Friday, August 12, 2011

DNBN Part I - How the site was taken over

As most fans of TVXQ know, the most prominent fan site of TVXQ was DNBN (동네방네 Dong Nae Bang Nae). Many fans, including international fans, used to visit the site to get the latest info about TVXQ.
DNBN's address was originally "www.dnbn.org", but soon after the breakup, most of the original admins resigned (basically kicked out), and the site was moved to the current address "www.dnbn.pe.kr" and is run by new admins. After the take over by the new admins, it turned into a fan site that only gave supports to the 3 instead of giving equal supports to all 5 members while advocating itself to be an OT5 fan site.

So what happened to it? Why was a most popular TVXQ fan site became a site that only supports CJS?

Here's a well known post by a blogger that explains in detail what happened at DNBN after the lawsuit was filed. It was posted on 1/28/2011, right after Akadong and DNBN finally decided to show their true colors by officially announcing their sole support of the 3..

http://blog.naver.com/znznakflf?Redirect=Log&logNo=60122923852

Here's the original Korean Text, and the translation.

아... 네, 이카동 공지 이후에. 이미 예상하고 있었던 일이 일어났습니다.
이카동 띠까리 동네방네가 공식적인 현판 갈아치우기 작업을 실행한 거에요. 
그런데, 너무나 뻔뻔스럽고 참 대담해서 이 상황에 대해 어리둥절하신 분들을 위해서 제가 부연설명을 하고싶어 졌어요.
정말 짜증나고 분해서. 동네방네가 여기까지 오게 된 그 전말이 너무나 궁금하신 분들을 위해서 제가 설명을 드리고 싶어졌다 이 말씀입니다.

왜 제가 동네방네를 그토록 역겨워 하는 줄 아십니까? 어째서 삼네방네라고 불리는 지 아시냐구요.
제가 판이 이지경이 될 때까지 동네방네에서 무슨 일이 있었는 지 설명드리죠.

소송이 터지고 나서... 그래도 그나마 예의있다고 '저 또한' 자부했던 동네방네 또한 루머 판이 됩니다.
규칙은 무용지물이 되고, 온갖 루머들이 돌아다녔죠. 그래서 결국 전 관리자였던 한 분이 공지글을 띄우게 됩니다.
그때 당시에는 저 또한 그 공지를 믿지 못했습니다. 대체 그 관리자라는 게 뭐길래? 이런 공지글을 세우는 거지?
게다가 니가 아버지를 만났다고? 웃기고 있네.

그리고 거의 대부분의 회원분들은 여기에 저처럼 반기를 들었죠. 
마스터 분이 자신의 권력을 남용했다는 듯이 분위기를 몰아갔어요. 저도 사실.. 그 분위기에 합류해서, 또 신속히 이 소동이 마무리 될 거라고 생각했기에
그 관리자분의 말이 허무맹랑하고 이상한 분위기를 조장하고 있다고 믿었죠.
사실 이때부터 의심을 했어야 하는데.. 동네방네라는 곳이 관리자분들에게 이래라 저래라 하는 경우가 많지 않거든요.
하지만 시기가 시기인지라, 또 사안이 사안인 지라 회원분들이 화가 났다고 믿은 저는... 그런데... 뭔가 이상했습니다.

다락방에서, 혹은 그 공지의 댓글창에서 목소리를 높이며 회원들을 '선동'하다 시피 한 분들 대다수가,
신생 회원으로 추정되는 분들이었거든요. 갑자기 나타나신 분들이 갑자기 끼어들어서 일명 물타기를 하기 시작한겁니다.
제 느낌이겠거니 하고 넘어갔지만, 나중에서야, 한참 후에서야 깨달았죠. 그게 물타기였다는 것을.

그분들이 어디서 유입된 분들일까요? 대체 누구였을까요?

그때 당시 다락방에 이카동 캡쳐가 하나 올라왔었습니다. 아주 우연히. 사실 지금은 그게 우연인지도 의심가는 바이지만...

바로 이카동에 누군가가 동네방네의 관리를 부탁하는 캡쳐였습니다. 그리고 그 글들에 대한 댓글들은 그것에 대해 옳다는 쪽으로 이미 기운상태였구요.

한마디로 말해서 이카동에서 관리가 나오기 시작한거에요. 그 캡쳐는, 그것을 알려주는 시발점이었구요.

실제로 이카동과 동네방네에서 똑같은 아이디/닉네임을 쓰시던 분들은 그 캡쳐 이후에 관리자에 대한 글들을 많이 올리셨었던 것이 밝혀졌고.
일단 그분들은 그 캡쳐 이후에 다 잡아내어지게 됩니다. 그런데, 아이디/닉네임이 다른 분들은 잡아낼 재간이 없었죠. 
결국 남은 이카동 스파이 분들은 더 활개를 치기 시작했습니다. 사태는 그 이전보다 더 악화되기 시작했어요.
그 캡쳐 이후에 이카동 분들을 어느정도 추스려 냈다고해도
이미 분위기는 기울었으니... 조금만 더, 조금만 더 불을 지피면 상황 오버였으니까요. 그분들이 물러설 이유는 없었죠.
정말... 절망스러웠습니다. 제 눈에는 누가 선동하고 있는 줄 뻔히 보이는데도, 너 이상한데 라고 댓글만 달면... 뭐.. 상상에 맡기시겠습니다.

결국 그 이후에 여러 관리자님들과 스텝님들은 탈퇴를 하시게 됩니다.
근데 가관이었어요. 그때동안 일해주신 건 생각안하고 등을 떠밀었죠. 악성댓글을 달고.
진짜 예의하나는 바르신 분들이었는데.... 아주 댓글란은 참혹했죠.
이때까지 수고하신 분들에게 아주 꺼지라며 침을 뱉는 꼴이었어요. 그리고 저는 그 댓글란을 보면서 동네방네에 대한 모든 애정을 접게됩니다.
진짜... 참, 

그리고 그 이후에- 현 org를 버리고 주소와 서버를 이전하자는 글들이 올라와요. 
근데 또 어떤 분이 정말 혜성같이 등장하십니다. 대체 어디서 나온건지 알 수도 없는데
현 동네방네 총 관리자인 사유리라는 분이, 갑자기 등장하게 됩니다.
대체 어디서 나타나셨는지. 여하간 자기가 www.dnbn.pe.kr라는 도메인을 사놨다면서 이전작업을 착수하겠대요.
회원들은 거기에 동의를 했죠.

근데 저는 그 꼴이 참 웃기고 어이가 없었습니다. 진짜 어디서 듣도보도 못한 분이 갑자기 나타나서

마치 이 상황을 모두 다 예상하고 있었다는 듯이 도메인을 사다놓은 그 상황을 의심조차 하지 않는 이 멍청한 회원들의 대갈통이라니.

진짜... 병신같은 것들.

하기사. 진짠지 훼이크인지 어쩐지 신상정보를 올려놨기도 했으니 병신같은 회원들은 그걸 곧이곧대로 믿었겠죠.

뭐~ 그리고 그 이후에는 여러분이 아시는 바와 같이 그 물타기/선동을 도맡아 했던 분들이 
도메인 이전 후에 스텝/관리자 신청란에 지원을 하게 되요. 전에 관리하셨던 분들은 진짜;; 백에 하나 찾아볼 수 있을까 말까 하게 지원을 하고..
스텝/관리자에 신청하신 대다수는...
누구냐고요? 누구긴 누구겠어요 한자리 맡으려고 발악하던 이모님들이지.

그래서 제가 동네방네와 이카동에 학을 떼는 겁니다. 이카동이라고 별 다를 줄 아십니까?
지금 동네방네에서 한가닥 한다 하시는분들 거의다 이카동 분들이시구요. 동네방네에 난입해서 개판 만들어 놓은게 바로 그 이카동 분들입니다.

한마디 하건데 지금 동네방네와 이카동을 분리해서 생각하시는 것은 전혀 도움이 안되요.

동네방네=이카동입니다. 그냥 간단하게 이렇게 생각하시면 되요.
뭐... 결론에 비해서 서론과 본론이 좀 길었죠? 뭐 그냥 이건 제 넋두리라고 생각하시고. 이만 이 포스팅을 접도록 하겠습니다.

Translation:

Ah…Yes, after the announcement by Akadong, its pawn DNBN officially changed their stance as expected. However, their move is so shameless and daring, it gave me the urge to further explain the situation to the people who are baffled by all this.
It’s so annoying and upsetting, I want to tell the whole story to those who are curious, how DNBN came to this.

Do you know why I am so disgusted at DNBN? Do you know why its called “SamNeBangNe” ? (note: Sam means Three in Korean, and DNBN is called “SamNeBangNe” by some fans because of they always supported only the 3) I will explain what happened at DNBN.

After the lawsuit… DNBN, considered to be courteous including myself, was run over with rumors. Rules became useless, and all kinds of rumors floated around prompting one of the ex-admin to post an announcement.

But at that time, even I couldn’t trust the announcement. I thought, who did she think she was? Why did she make such an announcement? On top of that, she met their parents? Bullcrap!

And most of the members opposed her just like I did. The atmosphere was turning towards the admin abusing her power.
 Even I... went along with it. I thought this crisis would be resolved soon, and I thought what she said was absurd and believed she was making things weird.

Actually, I should’ve suspected something at that time because it was rare at DNBN to tell the admins this and that, but I just felt that the members were upset because of the timing and (the sensitivity of) the issue… but, something was strange.

Most of the people instigating the members in the attic (members only forum) or posting replies on her announcement looked to be new members. They suddenly came out and started to drive members’ opinions.
I overlooked it thinking I was just being sensitive, but I realized much later that they were manipulating opinions.

Where did they come from? Who were they?

Around that time, a screencap from Akadong happened to be posted. I have doubts now if it was just a happening…
It was a screencap of someone asking Akadong to control DNBN. And the replies to that post were already agreeing to the request.

Simply said, Akadong came out to manipualte opinions. That screencap was telling the start of their actions.

After the screencap was posted, it was actually discovered that the members who were using the same id/nickname in both Akadong and DNBN were making many posts about the admin, and those people were all caught. However, there was no way to catch people who had different id/nickname.

Eventually, the rest of the Akadong spies became more active, and the situation started to get worse than before.
Even though some people from Akadong were weeded out after the screencap, they had no reason to back off since the opinions already tilted…… just a bit more push and the situation would be over.

It was really…hopeless. I could clearly see who were the manipulators, but if one raises any kind of question about them… well, I’ll leave the rest to your imagination.

Eventually, many admins and staffs resigned. It was a ridiculous sight to see. They were pushed away without considering all the work they’ve done until then. They were bashed… They were such courteous people…

The comments were cruel. It was like spitting and telling them to get lost after all the effort they put into. I removed any affection I had towards DNBN after seeing those comments.

Really…it’s…

And after that, suggestions started to come up to abandon the ‘org’ address and to move the address and server. Then, someone suddenly comes on to the scene. Sayuri, the current head administrator of DNBN, came out of nowhere. She said that she purchased ‘www.dnbn.pe.kr’ domain name and will begin the moving process. The members agreed to it.

I found that laughable and ridiculous. I mean, those foolish members with bird’s brain didn’t even question the situation where someone who was never seen or heard before suddenly comes out with a domain already purchased like it was already planned.
Really those… dumbasses.

I guess since she disclosed her personal info whether it was true or not, those foolish members probably trusted it at its face value.

Well~ after that, as all of you know, those who participated/instigated in manipulating members’ opinions volunteered for the staff/admin positions. Maybe one in hundred former admins applied for the positions.
Who were the most of the applicants for the staff/admins? Who else? It’s those aunties frantically trying to grab a position.

That’s why I am so sick of DNBN and Akadong. You think Akadong is any different? People who are “prominent” at DNBN are mostly from Akadong, and they’re the ones who broke into DNBN and ruined the site.

One thing I want to say, there’s no use separating Akadong and DNBN
DNBN = Akadong, simple as that.

Well, was my post too long to get to this simple conclusion? I’ll end the post now. Just consider it my grumblings.


=======================================================================

Here's the summary of the above post: the rumors were rampant at DNBN, and one of the admin posted some kind of announcement to control the situation. Akadong members infiltrated DNBN and used the admin's announcement as an excuse to kick out the existing admins and took over DNBN then moved the domain and server to the current location.

So that's how DNBN was taken over, and how they became a CJS fan site.

I'm sure the readers have many questions now. What was the announcement the original admin made that caused her to get bashed from the members, leading to her resignation along with other admins? Are there any proof that Akadong members manipulated DNBN? What happened to the old domain? Wasn't DNBN supporting all 5 at least until Yunho and Changmin decided to come back as TVXQ, prompting them to change their stance?

The above topics will be covered in my future posts.

786 comments:

  1. Thank you for the new post!!!
    I'm surprise & amazed at how aggressive & well-planned this whole fiasco is now that I get a feel of how it started. The level of manipulation is nothing I can ever imagine. The fans who got manipulated, presumably in the early teens are seriously too naive but the worst are those who manipulated them.
    It actually sounds quite absurd & scary to be in the fandom at the period of time...
    Anyway, can't wait for your next post!

    ReplyDelete
  2. One would think we are not talking about a kpop fandom, the conspiracies, the agenda's are at their highest levels-its actually scary!

    ReplyDelete
  3. You actually did updated soon Precious. lol. Keep it up and Thank you. lol.

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  4. CJS fans are really something huh? -_-" Sheesh. Blerk^^ To deliberately and calculatedly manipulate the feelings of others, disgusting. I can't blame those who followed too much, cause I got tricked too.^^

    Look forward to your next post^^ Thanks Precious^^

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  5. That seriously is creepy. And as more information about this situation comes out, it sounds more and more like it would be a good movie or a drama.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Once again, thanks for the post

    All of this conspiracy, reading it like this it doesn't look like it's fans work but professionnal. They succeeded in taking over DNBN without members raising an eyebrow and questioning the act?

    I don't know if I should pity the members who actually believed them.
    These stans are really something. Nothing can stop them, they are ready to do anything they can to protect their oppas.

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  7. my head is full of questions now... and that makes me think, if by just reading this I have questios, how is that none of the members said a thing at that time??

    they're so scary~

    ReplyDelete
  8. @ Irlanda
    There were people who voiced their objections, but those were minorities and ignored. This is my guess, but I believe most of the fans were confused, and in those chaotic times, any strong voice that provides any kind of direction would dominate.

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  9. ahhhhh so thats it. The original admins were kick out. CJS fans take control of that site and transform to a JYJ site.

    Very simple. Im glad that in the end there`s not old admins there because they were OT5stans since the beggining and create the site right?... Glad that they dont changed their mind, but sad and upsetting that a girl who appear from nothing take over a very important DBSK-OT5 fansite.

    Ima watching you Sayuri, you have a big power to manipulate brainless people, not that I admire you, but omg... you have such a power to create all this hell.

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  10. Personally I think this was planned probably before cjs left sm. That's why they held fan meetings that were supposed to be for all five of them at the beginning to sway the fans to their side. Their plans worked out very well indeed. There is no doubt in my mind that the take over of the biggest fan site of tvxq was planned. It wasn't just about the stans protecting their oppas, it was more than that. It was about destroying the reputations of homin and sm so their careers could soar. DnBn did this systematically even under the banner of supporting all five of them until they announced who they really supported(like as though it was a shock). Cjs wanted everything that belonged to tvxq without sm and homin.

    @Irlanda I think some of the fans had questions but were afraid to ask them because of the treatment of anyone who dared complain and question the new leaders of DnBn. Like you say they are scary. I think those who blindly followed had no reason at the time to distrust cjs at all. We were all fooled but then some of us woke up and started to think.

    ReplyDelete
  11. I think because Im an international fan I have no idea these things exist until I actually of course look for them or happen to run across them.

    I think part of the idea that this is all kind of scary and baffling is that I like in a world where Id like to believe people can be great but this is...just I have words I guess. It surprises me because I am new to Kpop and how the fans and certain things work. Like the cafes and so forth.

    The sad part is that in order for all of this to happen there has to be ill feelings towards whomever or a wish for things to go bad for someone else and that in in itself as a human being is pretty sad.

    Thank for taking the time to keep us updated while at the same time doing your own activities. :)

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  12. Crazy fangirls, did things that far for a fandom. But it happens many times in our life though, how few ppl but very vocal and have agressive behavior, can manipulate so many ppl opinions, especially if those ppl never bother to analyse the condition. We know that when TVXQ were still 5, many of their fans are like those ppl too. They only care about their idol and for them, the only thing they care about is that they can fangirling as usual. I think many of DNBN's members realised what happened, but they were silent bcs 1. they are afraid or 2. bcs they're JYJ bias. They still get JYJ info like usual, so they can ignore the problem. It's Homin's biased and 'real' OT5 fans who are affected the most.

    @blacksunshinenl
    LOL, welcome to Kpop fandom XD You should know that in general, Korean fans are..well..'crazier' (of course not all of them) than the others.

    ReplyDelete
  13. @ rosetta16

    Akadong is a TVXQ fan cafe for the members 20 years or older - teens call them "auntie fans". I'll describe it in more detail in future posts. They are now a "JYJ from TVXQ" fan cafe. That phrase is actually on their banner right now. LOLOL

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  14. @ Beatrixx07

    Yeah, and it was actually the "older" fans who did that (fans from Akadong) which shows age does not always relate to maturity.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Omg, that was written horribly on my part. I should know better.

    @Beatrixx07

    Lol, I am sure not all of them are like that. The ones I do encounter leave an impression. Im a fan since the beginning of the year so I am still finding out things. It does make for great conversation, Lol

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  16. Wow, this time u r really quick LOL

    It's just scary... and yes, it's planned, no doubt about it. As if TVXQ is just 3 of them, on purpose using a OT5 fanbase to support the 3 like that. Just like the claim from their idol that TVXQ was famous thank to 3 of them only. Simply scary, how low some people can become, really...

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  17. @Precious

    i don't think they are immature, but rather sinister and malicious. their systematic character assassination of Homin and the eventual takeover of their biggest fan site proves that.

    i have a question though, i thought that the current DNBN isn't run by any admins and the community runs itself (so to speak)? i'm sure i've read that in the site before. or is that just a ruse?

    you know those aunties are gonna come get you now...

    ReplyDelete
  18. @ shenancelice

    I'm trying, really I am. I'll make sure this one doesn't even come close to 1000 replies LOL.

    @ cat1177

    I was never a member of that site, so I don't know what they're doing now, but they always had admins, otherwise, how would they control the members with censorship? :)

    Last time I glanced over the site, it looked dead. They haven't accepted any new members, and I'm sure many existing members dropped out or kicked out. The site just looks like it's only being used as a billboard to spread their propaganda. It could be that only those who are involved with the site are left now, and if that's the case, then you are probably right. :)

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  19. @Precious

    i still remember the shock i felt when they spread that "form your own fan club" notice. i don't care that people claimed that it's targeted at SM for re-opening Cassiopeia for new members, since nowhere did it say that in the images so it was so obviously meant to harm Homin. these people have done a lot of malicious things, they're more a hate club than a fan club.

    ReplyDelete
  20. @cat1177

    What's the "form your own fan club" notice???

    @Precious
    Yeah, I think you're right, but it's still a bit disturbing how they just believed what the admins told them. But I've been a HoMin fan since the very beginning, so probably that's why I never believed 100% in rumors...

    It's 'Irlanda' by the way xDD

    ReplyDelete
  21. OMG thats a scary fangirls , i will not be shocked if one of jj sisters is one of the admin lol i saw then thy look scary but im little upset how come thy don't fight hard !! we are talking about the bigest site with more the what 100,0000 member how come thy let them take over !! no one believe in yunho and minni that time ?!! did thy doubt them !! its not so easy to takeover one of the biggest fansite , even now the ot5 fan is more to side jyj then yunho and minni !! so many Q pop to my head with so much sadness

    ReplyDelete
  22. @Precious:

    So this 'Sayuri' was the one who came forward and said she already purchased a new domain and everything? Wow, someone's prepared to take over.

    I am looking forward your next post, I am sure things only get more interesting from now on, *wink*

    @all

    It's amazing at that time what 'protect all five' can do, how it can rally the fans who probably was also scared and confused.

    Even now many fans still believes in DNBN or worse, TVXQ DC Gallery even after they sent out notice about how they won't acknowledge HoMin as TVXQ and boycotted the album.

    Nobody in the fandom is unbiased when it comes to things like this, no one.

    If they are truly unbiased, they would have believed HoMin like they believed ChunJaeSu, but we all know that HoMin are slaves and they are forced against their will to stay in SM... Yeah, that's why they look so happy when performing with SM town or speaks of the company with such a high regard.

    ReplyDelete
  23. @enolha

    these:

    http : //i56.tinypic.com/2i24zlw.jpg
    http : //i53.tinypic.com/21kvtwi.png
    http : //i51.tinypic.com/2r4ljk5.jpg

    and the CJS stans were like "i'm so proud of Cassies!" "you tell 'em!". mind-boggling isn't it how they used the 5 boys' picture to convey a hurtful message to 2 of them.

    ReplyDelete
  24. @Precious
    Will u post the next part 'soon' too? lol

    @Hyeonmu
    Yeah, the problem is, many ppl who claim that they are Yunho/Changmin fans or Yunho/Changmin bias, choose to support and believe JYJ only but not the new TVXQ, all bcs they believe that SM are forcing & threatening Homin and that actually Homin will leave SM if they can. Those girls won't believe what Homin said no matter what (they will believe it if Homin say smtg like 'we miss those three' lol).In the end (either they realise that or not), they bcm JYJ's supporter only and not Homin whom they claim are/is their bias.

    ReplyDelete
  25. @ Hyeonmu
    Yes, according to that blogger, she's the one who basically took over the site with the new domain and server. I've checked out some old posts, and it looks like Sayuri is the one who oversaw the petition sent to KFTC also.

    @ cat1177
    I'm becoming numb to those tactics too. Whenever I see those, I only see desperation to hold onto the TVXQ fame. They know their "oppas" are getting irrelevant. At least in Korean and Japan they are, and i-fans should soon follow.

    @ Beatrixx07

    That is my plan. Post my next one 'soon'. :)

    ReplyDelete
  26. it's kinda scary how all these happen... *sighz*
    makes me a bit embarrassed to be an older fan @ times to know that there's such immaturity out there... =X

    ReplyDelete
  27. Wow.. what a scary fans they are. Their hate beyond everything..sigh! I agreed with cat1177 "they're more a hate club than a fan club." Head shakes..pity them!!!

    However, I'm still proud with the current TVXQ Yunho and Changmin, how hard the situation at that time, they stand strong and prove the world that TVXQ is still standing there after the chaos! I just hope all the loyal fans Cassiopeia around the world, also Bigeast Japan or just casual fans will stand by them unconditionally.

    TVXQ Yunho and Changmin deserve to be loved and get fairness treatment whatever reason is..

    Thank you Precious, for coming back with the new article..Hehehe

    Btw..congratulation your blog getting more and more famous rite now. I saw some new readers here. Glad to see that more and more people know the truth about TVXQ!

    ReplyDelete
  28. After reading the post, I got so much questions but seems I have to wait until the next Precious post~ :)

    I kinda agree with most of comments here~ This DNBN seizing look so fabricated and really well planned... And it does look very scary indeed~ 'this fans' are infamous for being so well- organized in spreading hatred towards homin & SM, but its still surprised me how deep their hatred is :x

    I wanna know, as for Akadong... what is the stan of Akadong since the begining? Was it dbsk fansite who cjs biased? or was it fansite dedicated to certain members only (cjs or invidual cjs maybe)? :x

    ReplyDelete
  29. I understand some things, but this post really brought me more questions.
    I understood why DNBN became a JYJ fansite, but why Akadong decided to support only JYJ, and why take over DNBN? what was their purpose? if it is possible to know / understand.
    The more I read the more unfair this situation seems to HoMin.
    this is sad.

    ReplyDelete
  30. I am a Korean but.. "Akadong" is wrong. That is "Ikadong".(from "Isipdae Cassiopeia donghohoe") Always thank you for these hard works.^^*

    ReplyDelete
  31. @Precious:

    But I really enjoy reading comments here ^_^.

    U don't know how glad I am when I see the number of ur followers increasing. I hope more people would understand why TVXQ fans don't like the effort of YH and CM bringing TVXQ back is mixed with the mere words came from people who never care about TVXQ since the lawsuit began .The 3 didn't bother to mention about TVXQ when the name gradually forgotten, but when TVXQ was back, just shamelessly said they still r TVXQ or wrote some emo tweet and OT5s claim the 3 still love TVXQ, really... is love that simple? Just because they said they love, that mean they really do? The comeback itself means a lot of courage and effort, but comeback despite what those "friends" and "fans" were doing to them since the break up make it ten times harder for the duo. That's why I don't like how people deny the duo as TVXQ, group TVXQ and JYJ as one, or asking YH and CM to go to JYJ at all.

    Even when I'm not angry anymore, I always being emo when recall what happened to YH and CM, that's why I rarely write comment or else it will turn out like this one LOL

    Sorry for the ranting :). I'll wait for the next post :D

    ReplyDelete
  32. @ ~keigo_milk~ ^_^
    Nah, older fans are "usually" more mature, but there are always exceptions.

    @ ayoepan
    They were TVXQ5 site, but majority of their fans were Junsu's fans + some JJ & YC, and very few YH & CM fans.

    @ Jass
    I know it's 이카동 (Ikadong), but for some reason, i-fans call it Akadong, so I just used it. :)

    @ shanancelice
    Yup. When they were doing well, they were so happy where they were, and it almost looked like they wanted to do away from TVXQ name, but after they were suspended in Japan and TVXQ came back, they couldn't say one thing without mentioning TVXQ and YH, CM.

    @ all
    Yes, I'm really glad to see new readers as well. Even some of the people who brushes off this blog after glancing through it may come back later once they realize something is not right. They just need a cause to doubt their belief. From what I've seen, CJS's tweets work pretty well. :)

    ReplyDelete
  33. @ Precious

    LOL! you're right, there's no need to make an extra effort for people to come to this blog, eventually OT5 fans (who are open minded) will read this blog when they feel a doubt, an uncertainty about CJS and this whole situation sooner or later.

    I know a dedicated Korean DBSK fan (Yoochun specifically) who was so heartbroken when she finally heard the 6.25 meeting voice file. She couldn't believe it. Before, when word of it got out, she never wanna talk about that infamous meeting and even pretending that they don't exist. She finally have the courage and the strength to listen to it all. She said she couldn't eat for several days. She wished that she had the courage to listen long before to save her from such heartache. I told her, there are many like you. Her feelings about HoMin and SM completely changed 180 degrees.

    The more cjes file lawsuits, CJS tweeting, and their fans filing petitions, the more curious fans will come to this blog and FINALLY read it, instead of being spoon fed into beliefs by other 'FAIR AND UNBIASED' websites. ^_^

    ReplyDelete
  34. @cat1177
    wtf.... I mean.... well, I'm speechless

    @shanancelice
    Yes, I hate that too. I mean, from their music stile, to their image and their actions, TVXQ and JYJ are two VERY different groups. Why is that so hard to understand for them?

    ReplyDelete
  35. just like many other, this post really brought so many questions...and it's funny when they start the 'form your own fanclub' thing when they,who only support 'the 3' still want to cling to the Cassiopeia name...Why don't you guys go and FORM YOUR OWN DAMN FANCLUB and stop bothering and using DBSK/TVXQ name...srsly like idol, like fans

    It's scary to see how people with so much hatred and determination to destroy the other human being, I really want to ask them a question...

    What Changmin and Yunho (or even SME)ever done to them to make them hate HoMin and want to destroy their career to that extent?

    If only they can answer me this, have Yunho and Changmin ever directly or indirectly cause any harm or hurt them in any way...but then again, when hatred's so full in your heart, your logical mind will be useless...

    Yunho and Changmin deserved all the respect and admiration for always stood tall through all of this...

    thank you precious for this new post~ I'll wait patiently for your next update~

    ReplyDelete
  36. @ NoName

    I think some of the fans know there's something wrong but just afraid to seek the truth fearing the worst. For those fans, all they need is some sort of catalyst, whether their friends, an event (again, tweet works wonders LOL), or something to finally take that one step forward in seeking the truth. Once they take that plunge, then there's no turning back. That's why JYJ fans don't even want to mention this blog. Remember when they copied my 6.25 translation, they refused to put my name on it, and called me .... what did they call me? Some person? LOL Anyways, that's why.

    @ jaemin

    I don't know what's that "form your own club" thing is, but I guess when DNBN made an announcement, they told YH & CM fans and OT5 fans to form their own club? LOLOL By the time they made that announcement, there was virtually no TVXQ (YH & CM) or OT5 fans left but only some clueless OT5's and JYJ fans.

    TVXQ fans already had their own fan site, 2Paradise, so they were just boasting to pretend their announcement meant something. TVXQ fans were actually very happy (almost in the mood to party) that they finally came out.

    I think the only old TVXQ site that still claims to support all 5 is Yuaerubi (TVXQ fan cafe at Daum Cafe, not the same as Daum Telzone TVXQ Gallery).

    ReplyDelete
  37. @Enolha:

    Something simple but against what they want, they will never try to understand or pretend that they don't :)

    I remember when I still was a clueless OP5 fan, after YC showed off his tattoo without YH and CM's name on it, I felt so sad that I want to see it. Searching the pictures, I saw he looked extremely happy, and one o the comment I can't forget is something like...

    "While YH and CM stayed in SM to keep TVXQ name, JYJ go to western countries to spread TVXQ music. The boys know what they r doing"

    As clueless as I was back then, that comment still sounded so very funny to my ears. How come they think it the same when 1 side continuously appeared and smiled brightly, while the other only appear 1 or 2 times on the magazine covers?

    What does the JYJ group do that make people know about TVXQ? I only see the title like "The former members from the famous TVXQ now in a new group named JYJ", not the other way around like "More fans know about TVXQ thanks to JYJ". It's not "the beginning" or "3 voices" but the 5th album made that happen.

    ReplyDelete
  38. It's scary to think how something fandom related can end up as something like a conspiracy... How can something so harmless end up bringing so much harm to so many people... This is scary.

    I guess, the saying that the entertainment industry is really dark is true. Even the fans are not spared ):

    ReplyDelete
  39. @Tofu Fighter
    LOL, I think, entertainment industry (The Asian ones at least) and politics industry have so many similarities. Everything can be so dirty, image and popularity are extremely important, many people personality are fake, they have follower who can be blinded and used easily if those ppl aren't careful, they can manipulate some ppl's opinions, and they can use dirty way to destroy their competitor reputation, including using their fanatical followers. Idk if intertainment industries in all countries are like that, but in Asian, we know that most idol groups have young fans or adult fans who too emotionally attached that at some point, they can't use rational thinking anymore. They don't realise that in entertainment worlds, you can't easily believe 'everything' u read or hear in public.

    ReplyDelete
  40. Thank you as always,
    I remembered the day ***3 fansite declared most of TVXQ fansite support only *** (I don't want to see their names) and they brought the name of DNBN.
    hey hey, once I looked at the name, I was shocked. "DNBN"?
    Now no more respect left for this site.
    I declare this site to be antiTVXQ's fansite from that moment,

    They claim they still love HoMin but the acts are contradict.
    Just like their oppas. Like idols like Fans. very shameless.

    ReplyDelete
  41. @shanancelice

    Exactly!!
    I remember when TVXQ made a comeback, then the sales of 'HUG' increased suddenly. The reporters said that was thanks to TVXQ's amazing and powerful comeback. But then JYJ fans were angry and went "It's not just YH & CM, JYJ are working very hard to make TVXQ name known".

    When I read that kind of comments all I could think was "The sales increased in Korea. Didn't you say JYJ was banned in Korea? Then make a choice, JYJ is banned by evil SM and the popularity increase is just for HoMin; or JYJ also helped to increase the sales, but then they're NOT banned and it's simply tv shows don't want to invite them"

    ReplyDelete
  42. too much time on their hands or just flat out cray cray?

    http : //bit.ly/p5Fb6Y


    p.s. sorry Precious for the OT! it just unnerved me how far their imaginations would go to convince themselves that something is real. i'm genuinely, genuinely creeped out right now. i need that A-nation vid of Changmin happily fluffing his hair to Summer Dream *sobs*

    ReplyDelete
  43. @cat1177

    All I can say is I just skimmed that, knew where those crazy people were going with it, and had an "ew" look on my face my entire time. Seriously. Gross. I'm sorry to people in the fandom that do this, but I don't fanpair real people. I don't even fanpair Changmin and Yunho. Yes, I will support their friendship and brotherhood, but unless they really say they are together (which I doubt since Changmin's such a pervert for women lol) I'm not going to be like "Oh, they're totally husband and wife." I just think that's kind of weird personally and think having to do fanservice is uncomfortable and unnecessary for the actual people involved.

    What really gets me about the YunJae stuff is people are STILL pairing the two of them together today. On akp they had a picture of Yunho, Donghae, and Heechul together and people were like "Where's JeJung? We need YunJae" etc. And I was like, "Seriously? Even now? Can't you understand that's not real and that JeJung left the company?" I especially doubt Heechul would ever be friends with JeJung again, regardless of how nice Yunho and Donghae are. Again, I'm sorry to people in the fandom and community that do this or that were YunJae supporters at one point, but I just don't get it and never liked it, especially if both of them have asked people to stop it before.

    ReplyDelete
  44. @treya_barton
    Oh God, thank you. I feel very uncomfortable reading stuff like that too. Since me and my sisters are new TVXQ fans, when we try to learn about the old group and read stuff like the Yunjae stuff, we were like 0.0 , like really? Even where i live gay couples have rights to marry, but generally people still hasn't accepted the gay thing, people haven't accepted them, people just try to tolerate them. Although i don't dislike gay people i hope all these gay things/members paring will stop. I really want Yunho and Changmin to have a normal life, have families and children. If what they say is true, then i'll really pray hard that they'll be accepted for who they are (but i fervently pray to God that they are not). But seriously, i don't see anything that suggest that these two are like that except for people trying to promote them as a couple. Well enough of that, i just feel happy that me and my sisters are not the only ones who don't like "pairings" in Kpop fandom.

    And thanks again Precious for the update.
    and oh, i apologize for my sister's post regarding young immature fans, she was just kind of "had it" when she read young people posting non-sense comments, most of the time we just lurk here and read updates and comments.
    Thank you guys for sharing your views :)

    ReplyDelete
  45. @treya_barton and @yeona

    As a former YunJae shipper, I will say that it was actually fun at first. I mean, Yunho is so touchy feely when it comes to his members and apparently Jaejoong (and maybe the fandom) was thriving on how sweet the whole idea is.

    I mean, we all feel all warm when we watch a good romance movie, right?

    But I have always been a more 'casual' shipper. Sure I wrote fanfics and squee at their closeness, but most importantly I know it was nothing more than a passing interest. Whether or not YunJae was real has no effect whatsoever in my life. Whether or not YunJae is real is none of my business.

    But many of the current YunJae shippers are either young, immature, or still emotionally dependent. They NEED YunJae because for them, it portrays the 'ideal relationship', the 'ideal love', and the fanfics they read caused certain feelings to be invoked that they attach themselves to the feelings.

    Dare I say, some of them are addicted, and would feel lost without the pairing, because they probably have little else to ground their lives.

    @all

    This might be an interesting thing to try...

    Try and find an OT5 fan that is NOT a shipper OR a TVXQ fanfic reader/writer.

    I have been doing this for a while on twitter... and trust me, the number is very few... XDDD

    ReplyDelete
  46. @Hyeonmu
    i like HoMin but not as a romantic couple, but sometimes we read something like "HoMin is real", i like it when they say bromance, cause that's what we truly believe in. Anyway, it's just me and my sisters, our opinion on this doesn't affect our love for HoMin in any way. we don't look down on gays, but we think gays have difficult lives, and i don't want HoMin to have anything less than happy/healthy/fruitful and successful lives.

    ReplyDelete
  47. @yeona and @Hyeonmu

    Like yeona said, I have absolutely no problem with people who are actually gay. I have a lot of gay friends and if anyone in the kpop groups I follow came out I'd accept it. My problem with the fanpairing thing is when I really don't think the people being paired are gay lol I also don't mind the people who call Homin's friendship a brotherhood or a bromance because they aren't taking it to weird places at that point.

    And when it comes to anime characters or book characters that aren't real, I also don't have a problem fanpairing (I totally watched Tenipuri at one point and you can only enjoy the show if you fanpair people in my opinion lol). I just can't cross that line when it comes to real people with real preferences is all.

    As long as people are doing it casually I also don't really mind. If you're shipping for fun but don't take it seriously (like some people do) then sometimes I find it amusing or laugh at it. But when people take it seriously or go too far with it, it kind of freaks me out since they are real people. I just don't think people should take it to the point where they lose their connection with reality, like some fans do.

    ReplyDelete
  48. My other problem is I know some people, and this isn't everyone, that fanpair groups actually would be really upset if the members turned out to be gay. Back when I was in the DBSK community on lj I saw some cases of this. Girls would ship YunJae or ChunSu but then you would see some comments from the same person in other cases that were actually homophobic. I also noticed some people comment about that on the akp article about the lesbian drama that one of the Korean broadcasting companies aired. They were like, "People will complain about it in this instance, but if it starred JeJung and Yunho or some of the other kpop artists people fanpair they would suddenly be ok with it."

    I've read some theories that say some fans ship members because they'd rather the members be with each other (in a fake relationship) than with an actual girl because that means they aren't truly available anymore. And to me that's a little sad. I'd rather Yunho and Changmin be happy in a relationship and have kids (since they both say that's what they look forward to most in life, especially in Changmin's case since Yunho sees him married in 10 years lol) than single forever or in a fake/fanpaired relationship for the sake of a girl's imagination. I know when my favorite member of V6 got married a few years ago and had a kid I was really happy for him. They deserve that sort of happiness lol

    I guess part of me is upset that some people seriously push those sorts of fantasies on their artists and take it to the extremes that they do. I mean, I'm sure most female fans and some male fans even have imagined what it would be like at some point in a relationship with their bias, and that's normal. And like I said, even casually doing it for fun because it makes you happy is pretty normal for the fandom at least lol But to take it to the point where they've lost their connection to reality? Where they go to an SM Town concert and hold up YunJae posters when the group has split and it's uncertain if Yunho and JeJung really are even friends anymore (if their friendship wasn't fake to begin with?)? Where they speculate that JeJung walks funny at an event (just refer to cat1177's link) due to his supposed relationship with Yunho? It's just sad to me. And scary. Those are my major problems with it and why some of the fanpairing stuff bothers me.

    I think it's because I realize some people aren't doing it for fun and too many do take it seriously. I never liked a lot of the YunJae stuff or the ChunSu stuff before, and now that so many people are doing Homin it really turns me off lol I just wish most of it was simply about their friendship or brotherhood.

    ReplyDelete
  49. I'm surprised that some of you still stalking around in some YJ's site LOL. I wish some stupid comments there weren't from ppl in this blog.

    @Hyeonmu
    I was a YJ shipper too XD, though I believe them as bff not a lover. I'm an open-minded person and since it's like an open secret in Jpop fandom that some boys/male idols are real couple/gay, I open for possibilities in Kpop fandom, though till now, I don't find any pairs that I believe as real couple LOL.

    @treya_barton
    There are some girls who hate boys pairing bcs they think they will lose their chance to be that idol's gf since that idol is gay XD
    I agree that some fans take this YJ things too seriously. But we can't totally blame them. SM feed them with tons of YJ things in the past. The members themselves said things like 'Jae is the wife, Yunho is the husband', then that special drama with YJ heavy fanservices ('Dangerous Love'? I forget). I believe that they are not real lover, bcs real couple won't ever do things like that. Based on YJ's interview when they want fans to stop believing them as couple, I wonder if that bcs some fans do things too far, that I never saw in other Kpop or Jpop fandom.

    I don't care if they still fangirling over them till now, it's their choice. But somehow, being a YJ's shipper, is one reason why they can't or don't want to see or accept the truth about JYJ. We all know that many of this blog haters are YJ's fans. Idk, it's interesting to know if there is any JY fan (who believe they are still together till now) but also believe this blog here?

    Anyway, I advise we stop to see JY's or JYJ's biased site, if we really really don't like them (JYJ or JY). We know those are JY's and JYJ's biased, we know that they will write or say smtg we hate, so I think it's not necessary to go there, especially left stupid comments there (I wish no one in this blog do that) bcs I bet we will mad too if someone who hates Homin and this blog, suddenly come and write nothing but stupid comments. So as long as they still do that in their own environment and not 'dangerous' (like, let's go to SM's company and we safe Homin, etc) just let them in their own world. Okay, everyone :)

    ReplyDelete
  50. @Beatrixx07

    this blog popped up on twitter when i was searching for something. i honestly thought it was something to do with JJ's health at first lol. i get the whole fanfic business and why shippers need it in their lives and i like a cute bromance as much as the next girl (*cough*Jesse+Andrew) but the extreme ones just seem very disrespectful to people they supposedly admire.


    @yeona

    YH had already told fans in the past to not spread rumors about the 2 of them (AADBSK S3), and there's also the little fact that he's said that he's had 3 gf's and dated them 3 years each which means he wasn't single for the past decade. if he hadn't told the K&C kids that he's not dating i would've still thought that he has a gf right now cos he doesn't seem like a guy who'd stay single for long (well not that he'd admit it on national television anyway).


    anyway, the new song is fantastic!!

    ReplyDelete
  51. @Beatrixx07

    I never go to any other TVXQ site now except truetvxq and continuetvxq lol I only look at occasional links people post here just to see what they're talking about. And I wouldn't comment anything on their sites the times I do for the same reason you described. I agree - there's no point in saying anything at a JYJ biased site lol

    And as cat1177 mentioned, part of the reason why it bothers me is I do feel when it is taken too far it can be disrespectful. Like I said, I don't have a problem when it's done playfully or casually. It's just part of the problem I have with it is the fact they have asked people not to spread rumors, or said they don't approve of skinship (in Changmin's case), or have stated they've had girlfriends in the past (in both their cases).

    You're right though, in that part of the fanpairing thing was pushed by SM and parodied in the banjun drama Dangerous Love. I guess in the drama everyone ignored the fact that JeJung really didn't seem too happy with his perceived affection from Yunho lol I feel really sorry for the members of Super Junior (except maybe Heechul because he's the only one I could imagine actually enjoys fanservice for the attention lol) because it seems like they do fanservice way more than DBSK ever did. And you're right too about how they talked about it themselves sometimes. I remember reading some UFO comments in the past where the "couple" would be mentioned, although I always thought it was JeJung playing along with his fans. I can't remember if I ever read any of Yunho's replies that also supported it, but there may be. It seems to me that they used to reply to comments like that because their fans liked it though - even now JeJung seems to do the same thing with his tweets.

    ReplyDelete
  52. @cat1177

    Their new song sounds amazing. I can't wait for the full song to be released. I'm really anticipating Tohoshinki's new album so much - it sounds like it's going to be amazing ^^

    ReplyDelete
  53. @treya_barton:
    as a former YJ fan I can tell you, its very easy to get carried away with fan pairings etc, I agree with @beatrixx07 that its best to ignore that whole male couple scenario-because something doesn't become reality just coz people make up stories-
    I do believe that their friendship wasn't fake the pairing might have been-but knowing how kpop in general encourages such fan service it will be a while before fans/idols give it up.

    I cant stop spazzing over the new song btw, it is amazing, their voices sound heavenly.

    ReplyDelete
  54. @Beatrix07
    LOL! no, we haven't been to any Yunjae site, we saw them on Youtube actually when me and my sisters were looking for the old DBSK videos and related DBSK videos. We just want to know how they were before, since we read some comments on KYHD videos that they will be more awesome if they were five, although we've seen a few old dbsk vids, they don't seem to be that great to us, so we got curious as to what were they really before. Be assured we are not one of those who left stupid comments in there, we just lurk and very very seldom comment, just how we are in this blog :)

    @cat177
    really, he had 3 GF's? and he's only 25 right? so he started dating at age 16? LOL! it means he never got serious with any of them, well, i hope he'll find his true love soon, someone beautiful inside and out, just like him. I wonder why they can't admit they are in a relationship, here in the US fans are even more happy to know their idols are dating someone, at least we know who to hate (joke!) :DDD I guess fans in the US are more open or are not that crazy about our idols and we accept them for who they are, they just have to let us know :) Just like me and my sisters love Lady Gaga with all her weirdness and dramas, love Eminem with all his drama about Mariah carey, Justin timberlake with all his GF's drama, etc. I hope to see Yunho and Changmin introducing their GF's in the future, at least by that we know they are happy. :)

    ReplyDelete
  55. @yeona
    LOL, seriously? He had 3 GF in 9 years, and I assure u not all normal ppl (non idols) can even like that. Especially in entertainment worlds, it's pretty tempting to switch so many girlfriends or just having fun with no string attached since tons of girls throw themselves to those idols. It's not easy too to have relationship when they have so busy schedules and such. YH actually looks so serious in relationship, since he sucessfuly have a long term relationship with each of his gfs. He said he wants to have a gf who will wait for him to come back since he go abroad a lot.

    US and Asian are different. I think it's not bcs Asian fans are less open or more crazy. It's not that simple. They have different fans segment compared to the singers u wrote here. Most of their fans are girls/boys who possibly wish to be their gf/bf someday. Not all of them being fans bcs of the songs. That's why there is thing called 'fanservices'. It's also usual when an idol paired with another idol in a drama, the company will make rumor or smtg failworthy (like fanservices) about those two to attract attention. It's kinda difficult to do that if one of them already in relationship. Being single, is the best choice not only to gain more fans but also to provide more flexibility in case they to do smtg for popularity. Not all countries like that, I just take example from Kpop and Jpop fandom.

    Myb Homin will introduce their official gf, but not now, myb 5-10 years later (if we're lucky LOL) or if they already married.

    ReplyDelete
  56. I have to admit that I'm still a yunjae shipper in the sense that I still enjoy reading fanfics abt them... And honestly had believed that they were real, because of things I've heard from friends, who worked in the entertainment line... But I know that although they could have been real, they no longer are...

    Even though so, that post made me lol-ed... *perhaps back in the days when I was still OT-5, I would have been screaming in joy, or at least smiling in happiness* . It's honestly funny how many people are still holding on to that belief that they are back together...being a bit crude here, but it need not have been yunho...

    ReplyDelete
  57. @yeona and @treya_barton

    Agreed with you completely. I feel the same way. I believe that their sexuality is none of my business. Shipping for me has always been for fun, nothing serious.

    But some people do take it too far, like a fanatic YJ site actually greeted TVXQ in the airport in Paris with a photoshopped pic of Yunho and Jaejoong half naked from the waist above.

    I mean, even if they are dating, I don't think they would be overjoyed seeing it in public. Especially considering the eastern culture they grew up with.

    Not going to judge people on shipping anyone, but they do have to consider the feelings of people involved, because these are real people we are talking about.

    @All

    Is anyone aside from me replaying the 1 minute 12 seconds preview of Back to Tomorrow since it was released this morning?

    Ah, I want this full song out now!!! TT__TT

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  58. First time commenting in a while, probably from the absurdity of what CJS fans did. Honestly, when their fans go to the extreme like this, I seriously wonder what they're getting from it. I mean are they getting paid to do all these? It's just cruel to manipulate all those younger fans and attack Homin and their families for reasons I don't think we'll ever understand.

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  59. @Beatrixx07:
    *Raises hand* YJ shipper and HUGE believer of this blog present right here!
    @ALL:
    Lol, It is terribly difficult being both in this fandom.People judge so easily.I could be termed as a hypocrite for believing in both at the same time. Frankly, even I dunno how it works that way lol. That's why I keep my YJ preferences to myself but discuss about the issues taken up in this blog openly with all of you. (Even more because I know being a YJ shipper wouldn't go down well with most of you lol :P)
    I became a YJ fan after everything I read on this blog because I kinda separated them in my head. Whatever 'fancams' or 'evidences' so to speak seemed pretty real to me and I actually agreed with some of it. Yes there is a heavy deal of fanservice involved but it's the other stuff that made me believe lol.
    But I must admit, nowadays I am getting rather irritated at how YJ fans pop up at practically every article related to YH and talk about JJ. It's extremely immature.My interest in YJ has been reducing too off late. And about the sexuality of an idol, lets just say that we cannot assume anything.
    I hope I haven't offended anyone in this post so my apologies in advance. I just wanted to share how it felt being a supporter of Homin and YJ at the same time. It is extremely difficult.

    @cat1177:
    I'm quite inquisitive about that link you have shared. It has been doing the rounds in Tumblr and it was locked before I could see it. What does it say? I hope you can share :)

    ReplyDelete
  60. @Devika:
    I saw it b4 it was locked, gist, it was a dissection of why Jae seemed to be standing awkwardly and seemed to be in pain vis a vis his back at the PTB press con-i hope you get my drift- it seems he was checking his messages and smiling constantly, so more speculation-the detail in which this individual had dissected Jae's each move is actually quite amazing-i would say that girl is a hardcore shipper!

    ReplyDelete
  61. @Devika

    Hello, nice to meet you. Of course I personally have no problem with people shipping YunJae, I would be a hypocrite if I judge you on it. People can ship YunJae, but some of them took it too far... like... TOO FAR... hahahahaa... I think you know what I mean...

    Can I ask you something out of curiosity? I honestly know no other YunJae shipper that believes in this blog, so I really have no one else to ask...

    In your opinion, why did Jaejoong do it? Why did they left?

    And I don't know if you believe if the 5 will be reunited, but if you do, how do you think it would happen? If you don't, just ignore the question, LOL...

    ReplyDelete
  62. @ Reema:
    Oh.Really? Okay, that's taking it wayy to far.I really don't know what to say lol. Yeah, she is pretty hardcore.
    @ ALL:
    To all those who do not like YJ, please please do ignore what I'm going to write.

    @Hyeonmu:
    Hey there :) I'm glad you think that way.I know, I will definitely agree that some take it way too far.

    Hmm, about why Jaejoong did it, I'm really perplexed. YJ fans say that YH and JJ had an on and off relationship starting 2006 till 2009 and that they specifically seemed to be giving cold vibes to each other before the split. This was also noticed much before the news of their split became official because before the split,YJ fans brushed off their supposed animosity as a 'this too shall pass' kind of thing.It can be specifically seen in the YJ couple video by AADBSK ,in 2009 I think.JJ is known as an unpredictable guy, labeled as the No.1 in unpredictability by Mr. Jung himself in some variety show. (Come to play I think)That could give a pointer. I've thought that JJ was also hell-bent on getting out when he saw that YH was opposing to the same, out of some sort of stubbornness maybe.
    Sometimes I do feel that there is more to it than what meets the eye in this case. There might be more personal reasons, apart from the cosmetics business, as to why CJS wanted to split. Like some sort of compelling reason. Sometimes I find their leaving due to the cosmetics business as a silly reason, dunno why.I've even though about revenge. (lol, very fan fic sounding isn't it?)
    Personally, I do not believe that they will be reunited. It has gone way beyond that stage where thy can patch up, for me at least. There was a fleeting moment sometime back where I wished to listen to them as the five again because I absolutely loved their music before the split as much as I do now. But then again, it was fleeting because I remembered whatever I had read here.
    If they end up re-uniting anyway, well, I must say that miracles do happen, but it's highly unlikely.

    Well there you go, my extremely long answer to your questions simply because it's difficult to answer in few sentences due to the complexity of my feelings. It might sound like most of my ideas are inspired by fan fictions but no, I have genuinely thought of the above because hey, I too am entitled to such crazy ideas and speculations. :P

    ReplyDelete
  63. @Devika:

    Actually, your answer do make sense in a way... Much better than 'they are trying to save money to redeem HoMin', LOL. I do agree it's something personal, and let's face it, someone does act like a girl who dumped his boyfriend but then gets jilted when the said boyfriend seemed to be moving on without her.

    Do you think the pairing IS still real? or do you think the lawsuit and their abrupt leave marks the end of it as well?

    I honestly have no problem believing if someone say YunJae WAS real... but I personally don't think it IS STILL real.

    @precious: sorry for the crazy change in topic... The whole thing is just too fascinating for me, LOL

    ReplyDelete
  64. @ Hyeonmu:

    LOL @ the 'they are trying to save money to redeem HoMin', it never fails to crack me up. That is about just being extremely delusional.Extreme with a capital E.

    @ 'someone does act like a girl who dumped his boyfriend but then gets jilted when the said boyfriend seemed to be moving on without her.'
    THIS!
    This exactly sums up what I feel about the situation.I'm extremely glad that you could view it from the same perspective! :D

    About the pairing still being real, I'm divided on this one too. There are some 'evidences' that seem real and others, downright fake.Present YJ could be viewed as real or as the manifestation of the hopes of the YJ fans that YJ still maintain contact after the split, thereby keeping their OT5 hopes alive.

    tl;dr: I don't know if they STILL are real, but I definitely believe that there was something more to them than just friendship before the lawsuit.

    ReplyDelete
  65. Duhhh gurls
    change topic please

    ((dying))

    -HOMIN Shipper- LOL

    ReplyDelete
  66. @ The Watery:
    You could've totally ignored what I said Lol.


    Btw, I'm totally in love with the new song by them which has been chosen for a commercial. It had that distinct Tohoshinki feel to it, which I loved! Can't wait for the full thing! ^^

    ReplyDelete
  67. @devika
    you are not the only one... i am still a closet YunJae shipper, but i tend to not show it, becoz of many of the "bad sheeps" ....

    ReplyDelete
  68. Im sorry but I never believe that YJ was real, thats was only marketing! nothing more, and people who hear this and that, there`s not proof, only hear this from a people who is cousin of antoher person who saw this...weird LOL

    They were friend, I doubt if they`re friend now, but never lovers I can tell, but that is my opinion.

    And their fans annoying me, in Paris I was freaking mad because of he banner thing, thats was to much, I hope Changmin dont see that banner.

    ReplyDelete
  69. continue...


    I wish people stop talking about YJ thing here, omg everywhere I go there`s people talk about them. Im sorry but I just cant handle and now in this blog... *scream*

    Anyway people, you have the right to continue speaking about them but omg I feel really annoying right now T_______T

    /Im Sorry, dont hate me.

    ReplyDelete
  70. @~keigo_milk~ ^_^ :
    *Hi-5* I wouldn't have actually talked about YJ here but for that one question asking if there was someone who supported both YJ and Homin at the same time.

    @kingshim:
    I can understand your irritation but I believe that we followers have the right to post what we feel over here. Since YJ is a major part of TVXQ itself, it isn't surprising that the topic should come up here from time to time, especially in a situation like this.

    That being said, I would like to say that you too are entitled to your views, but please learn how to ignore the articles based on YJ if you hate it so much, like the disclaimer I put.Try to ignore it just like the nasty comments JYJ fans pass from time to time.
    Hope you understand :)

    ReplyDelete
  71. I try to understand YJ shippers, like I said before I know that people have the right to talk about anything they want^^ but OMG... even here, sometimes I get enough. And is very easy to say "ignore" because honesty is really difficult to ignored topics like that here.

    Like people say "ignored what JYJ stans said" but sometimes I can ignored those kind of people.

    Ahhh since when I said that I hate that couple?
    I never believe they were real and I get very easyly annoying by their fans, thats all.

    ReplyDelete
  72. apologies to everyone else for bringing that link here. like what @Reema said the detail and the extent to which the writer of that post went to and with those assumptions/conclusions as to why he was standing this way or why his hands were like that etc etc...i totally went wtf!!!

    i used to think that age plays a part because one look at those YJ vids and i knew they were just playing in front of the camera and i thought i'm probably too old for this. but i was surprised when a auntie JYJ fan that i knew told me about some YJ rumors that i guess she kind of believed in so maybe i was wrong about the age thing. however getting sucked in by watching the vids and then reading fics and putting the pieces together with rumors that circulates...i can see how fans can be convinced and turn hardcore. fanfics definitely play a huge part. it's like when Robert Pattinson (for lack of a better example) in the early days used to say how Twihards showed him blood on their necks or asked him to bite them; they project the character that they read in the books on to the real person until they're somehow convinced that the 2 are the same. which reminds me of what JJ said in the couple talk "Don't make those fantasy novels into rumors." (i don't read fanfics of any kind or anyone, and i'd bet that most people who don't believe in YJ don't either.) and YH was pretty worked up during that entire part, it was like he suddenly came alive after all the awkwardness. he was practically scolding fans in the nicest way possible. i felt so sorry for him when he said "i have such a hard time" and "one day people will think it's true." (oh but they already have hehe.)


    @The Watery

    LOL.



    ngl reading the last few posts was a cringefest for me. gonna slink off now and re-watch some Meets THSK to wash that all away (no offense to anyone). or i could just put BTT on a loop again which is what i did the entire day anyway.

    ReplyDelete
  73. PD: I hope nobody start to discuss with me since I stand my opinion about the YJ issue.

    Im sorry if I sound like an idiot/childish or something.

    ReplyDelete
  74. oh forgot to say...what do you know! YJ shippers in truetvxq haha.



    @kingshim

    i feel ya and sorry!

    ReplyDelete
  75. @Devika, @Hyeonmu,

    I personally think that there are many reasons why cjs left. Crebeau was one of the main reasons but I think they felt they were not fulfilling their artistic abilities as well(hence the comment on being idols rather than artists, and felt they had no say in what they could and could not do. Plus other reasons too that I think were pent up over the last year or so as Yoochun has mentioned. Maybe some of those reasons were personal but I don't think they were of the the romantic kind. I think the animosity was there because no matter how much pressure cjs put on homin, they refused to join crebeau and didn't feel the same way about sm like the three. As we know according to homin's parents statements cjs had put a huge amount of pressure on homin to leave with them but had failed. That alone was going to drive a wedge between them. So the animosity was not only towards Yunho but Changmin too. When I watch some of the videos from late 2008 to 2009 now, its amazing how fans could not feel the tension in the group because in some of the videos, they even stood separately with a big space between the three and the two. I'm not a Yunjae shipper nor do I think they were more than friends, but I don't have a problem with YunJae shippers as long as they don't take it too far like some fans do. I have read some YunJae fanfiction(out of curiosity of course, is my excuse) and well some of it is really out there, is how I'm going to describe it and leave it there. Whatever reasons cjs had for leaving, the way they handled and continue to handle the situation is horrible to say the least. Any closeness Yunho and Jaejoong shared long fizzled out sadly.

    ReplyDelete
  76. @apooli:

    Well, looking from your perspective, I can totally understand what you are saying.Yes, they could've also left due to all the reasons you have mentioned above.I'm not exactly sure of the timeline from when the tension began to seem evident or anything,but I noticed that it was most prominent from halfway towards the end of 2009,for most obvious reasons.
    YJ shared an amazing chemistry, something I have seen with my own eyes. I do feel bad that whatever has transpired in between them has only led to the loss of a really good relationship (be it friendship or whatever)

    @All:

    Frankly, I came here and spoke about YJ and my thoughts on them because I thought this forum was free enough and more accepting than anywhere else of course lol.

    The way I see this discussion, it is like debating on a topic, say religion. You have the believer's point of view, the agnostic's, the atheist's and many more. I hope you see this discussion and forum as a melting pot of the views of various types of people and their perspectives.

    ReplyDelete
  77. @ all

    I was gone for a day, and this post turned into a YJ discussion LOL.

    Here's my stance about JY pairing. I personally have absolutely no problem with gay people. I've had gay friends, and they were all great people, and I don't even think about them being gay while I'm hanging out with them. More gay men means less competition for straight men, so I support gay men all the way. LOL

    I also do not have any problem with casual member to member shipping. It's just another form of fantasizing which we all do with our favorite artists, like I fantasize about studying in the library with the members of f(x) and SNSD LOL (cough, cough). Every fan does it on his/her own way, so that's no bid deal, actually pretty common.

    However, I do not like YJ pairing. It seems like majority of YJ fans always blame Yunho for this breakup. They always slap all sorts of responsibilities on YH whereas JJ is just a poor victim in this. Even when they were 5, Yunho had the "man" label attached to him for the YJ pairing, and was always demanded to be the responsible man who protects fragile and weak JJ.

    He was bashed by YJ fans for going out with his old high school friends, leaving JJ all by himself.

    But worst of all, JJ himself always pushed for the YJ pairing whereas YH never seemed to be too fond of it (even though YJ fans would think otherwise). If you look at old videos/interviews carefully, it's always JJ who brings up or talk about stuff that insinuates YJ pairing. Sometimes he'd go a bit far with his role playing, and you can kind of see YH gets a bit uncomfortable with JJ's actions. YH played along with the pairing, but he was never active about it unlike JJ.

    We all know CM hates those pairing.

    But most irritating thing about the YJ pairing is that JJ is still using it to earn the fans' sympathy and instigating the fans to criticize and bash Yunho. Also the pairing, by definition, won't allow most of its fans to search for the truth, and force them to cling on to that false faith by turning a blind eye to what really happened. Then those extreme YJ fans end up creating all kind of lies and rumors to keep the pairing alive.

    If the 5 were together, I wouldn't care about YJ pairing, but at this point and in this situation, YJ pairing is only causing grief for Yunho. If YJ fans knew how to separate fantasy and reality, and just enjoy the pairing as lighthearted fun like some readers who posted here do, then maybe it's ok, but that's not the case for most YJ fans.

    Most former YJ fans who finds out the truth usually abandons the pairing because it's really impossible to get into it emotionally once you know JJ practically backstabbed Yunho with 6.25 meeting, cosmetics business, ssking Avex to block HoMin's Japanese activities, and his recent tweets etc. That's probably why many YJ sites turned into YH support sites.

    ReplyDelete
  78. aahahahah nv thought there would be yj fans in here. i'm one too! and i agree with what many of u guys said up there. yj was amazing in the past, not anymore of course.

    why cjs left? probably due to many reasons like crebeau, wanting more creative control, tired of all the long hours and schedules, disagreements with sm, thinking they can strike it out with their fame without the backing of sm. probably even some legitimate reasons that are deserving of sympathy.

    but how they acted afterwards. sigh. -.- and the 6.25 meeting. oh gosh. and how crazy the fans are..... they act like this whole thing is serious biz! b4 dbsk i've nv actually really liked singers/artistes, only with dbsk did i start following news closely, watching vids, talking to other fnas etc, and i thought i was a pretty hardcore fan already! some of these fans...i think...will support whatever their idol does, even if it's blatantly wrong. which is just quite sad, come to think about it.

    ReplyDelete
  79. @precious oooo i just commented a while after u. lol. the big korean yunjae sites turned to support yunho/yunho and changmin. makes one wonder, huh........ some fans i think said it came down to a battle between yh-biased and jj-biased fans. LOL. i doubt it.

    a question i've always wanted to ask. why are the korean fans so hardcore? (or maybe it's not just them? >.<)

    ReplyDelete
  80. This is hopefully my last post on this matter, I have been posting too much here lol.

    @ Precious:
    I have actually been quite interested to see what your say was on YJ (since the topic keeps coming on and on in almost every post of yours.

    I was surprised to see about how Yunho was blamed for leaving JJ behind and going out with his high school friends. That sounds lame lol.

    Yes, JJ has always seemed to like the pairing but his manipulation is something I don't seem to tolerate nowadays.In fact the day JJ tweeted about Homin I wasn't squealing in joy that he had uttered YH's name. It was quite the opposite for me. Neither do I like the extreme things done by YJ fans.

    Ahh, it is way too complicated for me to explain how I feel anyway. I love the current TVXQ, do not appreciate what CJS did one bit, yet I like the YJ that was there before the split. Or I think I like it mainly due to YH.
    Mine is such a rare case lol.

    When is you next post anyway? I hope it comes soon. I need to be distracted lol.

    ReplyDelete
  81. @ yetanotherfang

    I don't know why some K-fans act extreme. It could be that more hardcore fans are active online or they just stand out more. Interestingly, I've seen same behavior from some i-fans too. Either they learned it from K-fans, or maybe it's just the magic K-Pop artists have, bringing out the best and the worst from the fans. Or it could be some k-fans disguised as i-fans, who knows?

    ReplyDelete
  82. @ Devika
    No biggie. Your case is indeed rare, but I think I understand where you're coming from. I guess you just cherish the memories and fun you had with YJ, and you must be treating YJ stories as strictly 100% fantasy. It should be really tough for most people to relate to the YJ stories after knowing all the facts, but you must know how to separate the two like you said. In some ways, many fantasies are like that, like dead people coming alive which is impossible in reality, but often happens in fantasies, so if you look at it that way, it's understandable. :)

    ReplyDelete
  83. I don't think there's anything wrong with real people shipping just as long you can keep reality and fantasy separate in your mind. That's what I do.

    Especially with the way the K-pop groups play up fanservice. I had never even heard of fanservice until I entered this fandom. Take Super Junior for example...they do waaaaaay more fanservice than old TVXQ ever did. omg that Heechul is so outrageous, gotta love him though! Sometimes it's like they ship themselves...even with Yunho now calling Changmin his wife and how it feels like he's married now cuz Changmin nags him so much (LOL!). Or even that twin-concept HoMin did with the Japanese photoshoot had a lot of intimate shots. And actually on Tumblr I saw scans of new Japanese boy-love doujinshi for HoMin. And we all know boy-love manga/anime is huge in Japan.

    It's just all apart of the fandom. There's nothing wrong with it. But the YJ shippers (excluding shippers like Devika) are very very extreme. And like Precious said, it their bias gets in the way of them finding out the truth.

    I was upset when I heard about the YJ signs at SM town Paris. Changmin is the one standing by Yunho, singing and working hard with him. It's his name that should be supported by YH's, not JJ.

    I read all kind of fanfics from many fandoms...a good story is a good story. But I'm all about the HoMin bromance now. hehe! But hey, the day they announce their love for a girl, I'll be so happy for them!

    I love love their friendship. Despite all the lies and hurt they went through, they stuck by each other and only have each other now. I can't help but love/support/spazz about that!

    ReplyDelete
  84. I am new to this whole couple thing in Kpop and I was curious abut what everyone was talking about so I looked at a couple of things.

    I will say that it looked more like JJ was more into the coupling idea than YH. YH, his personality is the way it is and he respected all 5 and appreciated everything they did but it seemed for some reason that JJ was more into it than YH. YH seemed to be uncomfortable at times. Not always but I could tell in certain instances. Could be just me, but I am just another opinion.

    It actually surprised me how hard core the pairings were just because I did not come across them until now. I am way behind on Kpop history or on how it works.

    Anywho, looking forward to future posts!

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  85. @scy17

    "I was upset when I heard about the YJ signs at SM town Paris. Changmin is the one standing by Yunho, singing and working hard with him. It's his name that should be supported by YH's, not JJ."

    Omg this is a perfect comment because thats what exactly how I feel (and think) when I go to Paris and saw them.

    ReplyDelete
  86. @kingshim:

    I can't imagine how you must have felt seeing those things in person. I only saw pictures and I was PISSED OFF. Let's face it, whether it's true or not, any shipping is actually an object of the shippers fantasy, in most cases sexual fantasy. It's one thing to know people fantasize you sexually, it's a whole other thing to have it thrown in your face on a constant bases.

    When I saw pics of those sign and the photoshopped banner, I pity all shipper that was masochistic enough to follow me on twitter, because I didn't reserve my opinion on the whole matter.

    @all (especially Precious)

    Again, sorry for the weird topic, but I have to say the whole psychological aspect of it never fails to amaze me until now. Dare I say, some OT5 NEED to believe that the pairing is still real, because otherwise there isn't anything to help them believe that the five are still connected socially, but it is absolutely hilarious to see the crazy theories they came up with.

    I have to say, I am glad things turned out this way. I am sad that Yunho and Changmin had to go through so much at such a young age or that personal relationships built through years of hardships seems to just... fade, but I am so very grateful that THEY DIDN'T BREAK UNDER THE PRESSURE.

    I am happy to see that they have each other, that they have truly became 'brothers' for all the crap they went through, and I am especially happy to see the support system they have. Fellow SMtowners, their family, and finally their fans, who said 'screw the rumors, we're sticking by HoMin'.

    People will always try to bring TVXQ down, but Yunho and Changmin has proven that they aren't going to stay down, and for me, that is the biggest victory they could attain. A victory against their own shortcomings ^___^

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  87. Oh, just want to share something...

    In the CTVXQ forums we have a thread where people are welcome to introduce themselves. I was so happy to see many new fans, either people who never knew Kpop before KYHD, or that they never cared about TVXQ before KYHD, and we even have a fanboy who said that he definitely respects Yunho and Changmin for their actions...

    But one of the comments I love the most was actually a new fan, who had just recently started liking TVXQ when she accompanied her sister to watch SMtown Paris... yes, she even thought TVXQ were rookies, LOL. It was the KYHD jump that won her over.

    Also another comment that makes me happy is a BigEast who recently watched A-Nation in Nagoya, and she expressed how sorry she was for ever thinking that Yunho and Changmin lacked anything. She still have a very strong opinion about TVXQ's original line up, but she also said that 'Yunho and Changmin are truly protecting the name'.

    I love that Yunho and Changmin don't spend too much time convincing people with their words, they do it with their actions. Like Yunho said in Meets THSK 4, it's not enough to show your commitment through your words, you have to show it through your actions. I'm a proud noona... XD

    ReplyDelete
  88. @ Hyeonmu

    Nice for you to share other fans' experiences, especially new fans.

    Just like you stated in your comment, YH & CM spoke with their actions, not hollow words, and that gets my total respect.

    Sometimes, it sends me chills thinking about the dark times they must have endured. I sometimes put myself in their shoes, and it really made me furious what some people once called themselves friends did to them. Makes me shake my head in disbelief many times just thinking about it even after all this time.

    But I am that much proud of them, how they came back stronger than before and showing the world that they are standing tall despite all the "unfair" hardships they went through.

    I'm a proud hyung. :)

    @ Devika

    Forgot to answer you: I'll make a new post sometime this week.

    ReplyDelete
  89. @Precious
    If you're a proud hyung, am a proud mum. Knowing most of everything that they went through and imagining what they must have endured..was a huge factor that made me a fan.

    sorry for adding to this shipping topic: the friend who introduced me to TVXQ was a hardcore YJ shipper. She threw alot of those fanvids, interviews and other "happenings" in videos lol cos i honestly thought that J was swinging the other way the first time i saw them lol She said that if you think he is then YJ is real! yaddayadda but tbh, i never felt any vibe from YH, it's always been a fanservice-vibe. Actually, i felt the same as Precious. it was more like YH goes with the flow after JJ initiated it, then teased by ChunSu (and cheers from the fans). I never or haven't seen CM push them for it. It's more like he disapprove of it -- fans called it cockblocking haha maybe cos he knew what Yunho (and his GF then) might have felt about it =D YH is just a very touchy man after all just look at how he interacts with SJ and Shinee kids and other dudes. Or maybe am too much of a new fan and that I only saw evidences that were just the tip of the iceberg xD

    It was only my first time to hear people shipping real life straight guys xD I'm familiar with, and read yaoi but i never liked it. I was sooo surprised when i saw photoshopped pics and read a fanfic xD My other friend (who is a hardcore yaoi fan) was also surprised (more like surprised in disbelief that shipping happens in RL fandoms) when i told her that the manhwa she reviewed was a fanmade manhwa based on TVXQ (chunsu).

    I don't like yaoi but I don't mind people if they ship two straight men so long as maybe they don shove it down those men's throats and that peeps can differentiate reality from fanfic. I can't imagine what Changmin would think and do when he sees yaoi stuff of them xD

    @apooli
    re: tension in vids between 2008 and 2009. Yeah, I've noticed those too..and that was during the time i didn't know the timeline of "events". Ive seen instances where CM was on the verge of bursting or would've if it weren't for YH. Look at MC Mong radio show, he was really on the verge of bursting there hahaha and there's also a tension between YH and JJ cos YH ignored him after his "message" to YH..and he only remembered to thank him after he gave his msg to CM kekeke

    back to topic:
    wow. the fandom had a huge contribution to the chaos. It's quite scary and unsettling how rumors can easily be believed and how the instigators conspired to bring SM and HoMin down for what? more fame for their so-called brothers?! D'x

    Here I thought the legal case would make a very good thesis for would-be lawyers or those studying business ethics and law..it looks an analysis of TVXQ fandom behavior during the chaos can also be a very good study for Behavioral Science and Sociology.

    Looking forward to read more about it. Unbelievable!! My heart goes out more to Yunho and Changmin. Learning about all these makes me want to support them more and more and more.

    I like tvxq as 5. I still think they had the potential to dominate or at least do really well in world music scene. But I love and adore the current TVXQ like I never did any other artist.

    ReplyDelete
  90. add me to the "proud noona/hyung/mum" list. it's amazing to me that there are people like this in the entertainment industry, and in k-pop no less. the way they handled themselves throughout this mess, plus YH's quiet strength and good nature, and CM's razor-sharp wit and good sense, not to mention their incredible talents, what's not to admire?


    @apooli

    like you i don't think Crebeau was the sole reason, but rather the trigger. after all it's not a coincidence that they're separated in the way that they are.


    @girlpower

    "I can't imagine what Changmin would think and do when he sees yaoi stuff of them xD "

    he would shudder for a good minute or two lol. i'd love to see that cos it would be totally cute hahaha.
    oh i agree YH is very touchy with just about anyone or anything. men, women, the elderly, kids, animals. even the way he talks to his dog turned me into mush.

    i think the tension between YH and JJ in the months leading to the break up has more to do with their roles as the two oldest in the group (rather than anything romantic-related). i'm sure they felt the disappointment and the hurt more because as oldest they hold more responsibility to the group and to the younger 3. i never believed that the 5 separated and remained in very good terms. (i have a feeling that their old fans never watch Homin's interviews this year because they're afraid of what they might hear. i mean they're still quoting what YH said years ago about wanting 25 kids lol. err he's been saying for the past months that he wants 2 boys and 1 girl.) people don't need to watch a lot, seeing them talk about the lawsuit in KDG is enough. when YH said that he didn't expect that the 3 would take an---, then CM butted in with "extreme" (measure), the look on CM's eyes was very severe and cold. even if you just watch that one bit you'd know what they felt about it. even if it was never CJS vs. Homin, their actions directly affected Homin's lives and careers.

    i like the old TVXQ too (a lot actually). in fact their Secret Code concert dvd is right up there in my favorites list along with U2's Boston 2001 and Slane dvd's which are my all-time faves for many years. great music is great music, and i will always recorgnize how amazing they were as 5.



    @scy17

    "I was upset when I heard about the YJ signs at SM town Paris. Changmin is the one standing by Yunho, singing and working hard with him. It's his name that should be supported by YH's, not JJ. "

    A+++++++++++++++++++++++

    ReplyDelete
  91. @ devika

    I'm also a YJ shipper and a HoMin supporter. I know it's quite complicated. But I'm not a hardcore YJ shipper, I just thought that YH and JJ have great chemistry together. I just find some of the "evidences" funny though and sometimes it leads me to a more confused state. On another note, I remembered the game between CM and JJ wherein CM said that JJ wanted to be popular. Thinking about JJ's recent tweets, probably, he is using YJ to gain more popularity.
    Maybe there was really something between them or maybe not. Only them holds the truth. Honestly, I was also curious if there are others who are both YJ shippers as well as HoMin fans but I was too afraid to ask.

    @ all
    Just my opinion, basing from their personalities, the reason probably that the 5 broke apart is that they have very different principles in life even though they share the same dream. The cosmetic business was the one that triggered their differences in their views about what is good and what is not, about loyalty and betrayal, and about money and power. One can clearly see how down to earth HoMin are compared to the other 3.It was and still is a very noble thing for them to protect TVXQ'S name and reputation.

    Change of topic, when will tvxq's full version of "back to tomorrow" be released? The preview was awesome.

    *back to lurk mode*

    ReplyDelete
  92. @precious @all

    I used to be a YJ shipper before the lawsuit, but I was shipping them casually. Because I know that JJ is always an attention seeker since debut, so I wasn't surprise that he's more fond for the pairing. And I've noticed that YH is always touchy to his close friends anyway. I was just enjoy watching their fanservice which did created the chemistry.

    I am not a YJ shipper anymore with obvious reasons but I still know a bunch of friends who are still YJ shippers.

    Because I am Chinese so all those friends of mine are Chinese as well. There are something very interesting I've noticed in the Chinese YJ fandom. That is for those that still believe in YJ until now , many of them actually hate JYJ as a group. These people actually angry at the other 2 members of JYJ for luring JJ to leave with them and they think JJ was just stupid enough to be tricked by them. So these fans blame chunju for YJ's breakup.

    lol I personally found this theory very funny & unbelievable.

    ReplyDelete
  93. Oh my. Imaginations are running wild now. I came across this:
    http : //news.ameba.jp/20110816-18/

    It's in Japanese and the translation roughly means this-


    "『TRANS』[This thing,I don't know (the truth),Yunho and Changmin met each other]
    July 26, Jaejoong (25) tweet about his missing to Yunho (25) and Changmin (23). In April 2010,since the confirmation of the deactivation of Tohoshinki (5 members) and divided into 3 people and 2 people,causing a war of words. Japanese journalist said : "Recently in fact,next year,DBSK will comeback as 5 exclusive only in Korea. Korea has been driven to a KPOP boom by them. Now in process to comeback five again""
    Source: Articles - September 01 Issue [August 25 2011 Women's Seven]

    Here we go again.

    @jarlette:
    I'm glad there is one more person like me lol. I can understand why you must've been afraid. Obviously my discussion hasn't gone down too well with some lol.

    ReplyDelete
  94. @all
    I'm sorry if one of my question distub some ppl here :) When I know them for the first time, I believed they were lover that time (thanks to their fancams, their closeness in camera (I believe they were really close), and their fanservices) but just for a while. One day, after I spoke with my friend who had hard time bcs ppl rumored her and a girl had a romantic relationship (which was true, btw XD), my logic kicked me. I thought it would be more believable (they as real lover) if they acted nothing in camera but show their closeness in fancam (when no camera around), since like I said, if they were really gay (especially idols), I highly doubt they would show that proudly to public. But they show their closeness both in fancam and when camera was on, which is what friend normally do. Oc, I might be wrong. Who knows, myb JJ is a special case which he didn't care if ppl found out that he and YH were gay couple lol.

    @Precious
    You remind me of a biggest YJ site in Korea which changes into Homin's site. Many YJ fans had difficult time bcs of that. Especially bcs the mod said smtg like she was dissapointed of JJ and if the fans want to blame someone, pls blame JJ. Well..if a former YJ's hardcore fan said smtg like that, obviously JJ must have done or said smtg bad. I was still JY fan that time and I could feel how some of my friends (who are hardcore YJ fans) were totally sad and confused.

    Sorry for adding another YJ topics XD As a former YJ fan, I have no problem with talking about them from a fan or non fan views. Anyway, YJ's topic is really related to Homin's/TVXQ ones, since many of YJ's fans don't want to see the truth (or believe this blog) and some of them, still bring YJ things in TVXQ's concert. Many of them, blame YH for leaving JJ alone and such XD. Btw, speaking about YJ banners, they not only do that in TVXQ/SM's con, but in JYJ's con also. I rmmbr many JYJ's fans mad bcs of their behavior. I was kinda bothered bsc many of them complained why those girls didn't do that in Homin's con too (idk, will it make any difference?) and some of them accused those girls as JYJ's haters in disguise and they did that to destroy JJ's reputation. Worse, they accused those girls as Homin's fans since 'they didn't do that in TVXQ' cons. See, how what those fans do just bring another hatred to Homin *sigh*

    ReplyDelete
  95. @Devika

    I will trust that TVXQ will be reunited when there's an official statement from SMEnt, Yunho and Changmin.

    I don't get how they will do their activities as 5-member-group in Korea and a duo anywhere outside Korea, but hey, every detail will fall into place somehow.

    I will say this, I have seen how dead and sad Yunho and Changmin was at the end of 2009. My heart ache when I saw them at FNS Kayosai, Kohaku or other appearances they have after November.

    As long as they don't show me that face again, as long as they are happy and lively and be who they have become after months working their asses off, I am ready to support TVXQ, no matter how many members they have.

    But I doubt I can care about any other member the way I do these two boys.

    I trust Yunho and Changmin, I trust that they are well aware and well in power to make their own decisions. As long as their values doesn't go against mine, I am here for the ride ^___^

    ReplyDelete
  96. @Devika
    I think why some ppl here can't accept JY's topics well is bcs they are disappointed with JJ. Well..since they feel that way toward JJ and they care about YH so much, it's kinda hard to imagine them act as lover, even in the past XD As I see, u and some ppl here who still shipping YJ but believe this blog too, have an excuse why JJ did this or said that, I rmmbr some of the girls like to defend JJ in some way like how he has the least sin compared to two other members, so all of u still see him in more positive way. But the others are not XD I rmmbr ctvxq forbid the members to talk about JYJ or bring their names, bcs many fans are so sensitive with their names.

    Btw, I am involved in Jpop fandom too and your source (Women's Seven) is unreliable. I rmmbr someone brought a rumor from Tokyo Sport, which is also another 'yellow tabloid'. I wish i-fans won't believe that easily. I had many experiences with that magz about Japan idols and most of their rumors were funny and laughable XD

    ReplyDelete
  97. (Devika here)
    @Beatrixx07:

    Thank god that it isn't a reliable source. I keep following various Tumblr blogs about TVXQ and I saw this. People ( OT5's mostly) are taking it quite seriously too.

    Haha, your first paragraph about your opinion on YJ is closest to what I think about them :)
    Actually I don't see JJ in such a positive way. I joined this fandom only recently and I haven't liked anything that JJ did post split. In fact I almost try to avoid any current news about him. But then again I liked the YJ before the split. In short, I liked the JJ before.The one when I thought there was some genuine YJ stuff going on. I do not like him that much now because of his attitude.

    P.S:And yeah, maybe JJ is a special case :)

    ReplyDelete
  98. @beatrixx07

    That actually still stands, hahahaha...

    In the past, any mention of ChunJaeSu or any shipping leads to an argument. Like it or not, OT5 (esp those who are more CJS biased or YJshipper) will create some excuse to justify their actions, while most HoMin fans know how horrible it was, not only for HoMin, but also for their fans.

    Before CTVXQ, most of us had to deal with 'neutral OT5 sites' that lets HoMin bashing drags until HUNDREDS of comments but cut them short when it comes to CJS. CTVXQ admins were committed not to let such incident in our site, because as admins, we are responsible for what's happening inside.

    That's why CTVXQ never even post anything related to the lawsuit, because Precious is already doing a great job covering that aspect of the fandom, hehehehehe

    ReplyDelete
  99. @DM said...
    Yeah, who knows..myb that's why YH looked not comfortable since he was afraid ppl would..okay, I stop XD

    OT5 will take anything that bring their hope high again, no matter the source. Especially if they are not familiar with Jpop, they won't know which media is reliable or unreliable. For ppl here, the example of yellow media in Japan are Tokyo sports, Women's Seven (Josei Seven), Friday, and some others, but I familiar with those 3 the most. If u take use Tokyograph as your Japanese's source, remember that those site is similar to AKP, which means it takes all Japanese's articles (official or rumors) and translates it into English, so we should pay attention to their credits sources too.

    ReplyDelete
  100. @Beatrixx07:
    Your train of thought is awesome! :P :)

    Thanks for the tip. I'll keep a look-out on those.

    But really,at the end of the day, whether they reunite or not, I want to see Homin happy. They have taken the worst beating for whatever has happened. I just wish the best for them.

    ReplyDelete
  101. @devika & beatrixx07

    i agree with u guys about your views on YJ. and i used to be a HUGE fan of them. i didn't like whatever jj (and yc and js) did after the lawsuit. (whenever anyone tells me how amazing they are, i just kinda shut it out, even though yes, they are talented singers etc.) i liked the old yj too, i thought they were pretty damn cute together...in a way. hahaha.


    but oh well, i guess one has to learn how to let go.

    ReplyDelete
  102. Hi all~~!!!

    I just found this and I was like "no again this crap"

    sweeeetspring.tumblr. com/post/8992658239

    and Its so ironic how people just believe in people who are not even have real source, its just translation of this and that, assume how real is what they said -sighs-


    This is hella tiring. Some people blame SM for overwork Changmin and Yunho, others blame for not make to them a big concert JUST only for them.
    Some of them wants everything from homin and others wants them take rest.

    I dont and I will never understand the fan brain honesty.

    I mean in my case I always focuz more in CM and YH health, for me its the most important thing. I get worried when I saw them in pain.


    Yeah its true that I want a concert only for them, but if they dont feel with the confident to make a big concert now I will just wait until they think "ok! lets do it!"

    ReplyDelete
  103. lol another day another ot5 conspiracy. nothing makes sense here, TVXQ is SM's money tree but at the same time SM is making their popularity slowly fade away? :ROLLEYES: there is something posted on facebook (and re-posted on ctvxq) about how SM will "isolate" Homin if they don't win the year-end awards, which is nonsense because if they weren't cast aside a year ago then why would they do it NOW. and Japanese tour has already been planned for early next year -_-. i understand that they hate SM and they're obsessed about the idea of a reunion but spreading brainless stuff like this is just harming Homin (that is if these are even real ot5 fans).

    oh and imo the reason that there's no Korean tour yet is because their Korean fandom is f-ed up. Homin knows it, SM knows it. the logical thing to do is go ahead with a Japanese tour first where they're welcomed with open arms and (most of) BE are united.

    p.s. hate to say this but if there is anyone in the company in danger it's Shinee, what with M1 debuting in a couple of months. i don't know what this group's concept will be though and how close in age range they will be with the Shinee boys (but i'm guessing not a lot since Shinee boys are still young).

    ReplyDelete
  104. forgot to say that TVXQ (whether 5 members or 2 members) is SM's pride. for SM: TVXQ = SM. the group and Homin will always have pride of place in the company. TVXQ's failure is SM's failure, and SM will never allow that to happen.

    ReplyDelete
  105. @cat1177
    I agree. TVXQ is SM's pride..along with Girl's Gen ;) Just look at LSM's CF with that investment bank. The message in that post was almost believable until you read the part where they will be isolated. o.O

    With SuJu's comeback (maybe the last album Leeteuk and Heechul) and that rumored and probably very true comeback of Girl's Gen, our boys' chances with the highest album sales and probably the year-end awards may have slimmed. regardless, I still believe in them and no matter what the outcome is, I will continue to support them no matter what.

    What made them think that SM will isolate them, when they didn't during the chaos, proved that they (TVXQ) are still highly regarded with so many endorsements and are the driving force to sell-out group concerts is just.....errr.....irrational. sorry.

    LawL what a pathetic way to try to bring them down xD

    @kingshim
    me too.. (re: fan brain) some call Yunho a sissy for giving up on KnC when they know his schedule is just too tight; the same people call SME evil for making Changmin work with a cast on his hand órz; same people asking for concerts and performances left and right and then call SmE evil (again) for exhausting them with work; and the list goes on and on x'D

    ReplyDelete
  106. @all
    i have a question: is the korean fanclub Cassieopeia, the same as BigEast where they have a "term" for membership where they can opt to discontinue after 6 or so months?

    ReplyDelete
  107. @girlpower

    in some ot5's alternate universe SM deems TVXQ worthless if it's not 5 members, so spread these conspiracy theories around. they can't stand it that the 2 could make it on their own. why not just support both TVXQ and JYJ and want for them what they want for themselves.

    ReplyDelete
  108. After reading last few comments, somehow felt like we got really sidetrack from the subject matter of DNBN. As far as pairing or non-pairing, it is really an individual’s own preferences. So, let’s leave it as that.

    When Precious wrote “Auntie,” I imaged more towards the Ajumma (An army of Granny types in flowery pattern pants/skirts). I was amazed their abilities to take over the site. Who knew Granny could take over the world. Silly of me, I now realized it was referring to people of 20 or a tad older. Forgot a majority of their fans, especially fan-girls were in their teens. LOL. After that, an egging feeling arisen that some of the major female players of 6.25 plus a certain member’s mom (the true behind the scene ring leader) might have taken parts in the coo (hostile takeover) of this infamous TVXQ fan site. How else would they come up with the money and speed to do this to a site filled with so many fans? That I wonder? Ok, ignore the conspiracy theorist here (plus an X-file fan “The truth is out there!”)

    Can’t wait for part 2 of this DNBN! Until then, anxiously camping here for it! The real life TVXQ soap opera is quite mindboggling and the more we know…we realized how less we really knew back then. Thanks to Precious and this blog, it’s planting a tiny seed of doubts (in what CJS side is showing) to many (including previous nonbeliever/CJS only fans); we now can see the past situations in a whole new light.

    ReplyDelete
  109. @cat1177

    Did someone really posted something like that in ctvxq? Please DM me the link I will remove it.

    These kids don't even know how the industry works, they don't know what goes on internally within SM. Funny how they say 'we don't know what goes on between the five beneath the surface, maybe they do still support each other', but believe easily on theories on how evil SM is behind the scenes.

    But they can believe whatever they want, just don't expect me to start sharing their 'faith'

    ReplyDelete
  110. @Hyeonmu

    oh i think it's in the topic of the MTV cap of CM squished next to Yunho on that couch lol (main site, not the forums). ppl are discussing about the GDA there haha.

    ReplyDelete
  111. @all:
    some of these OT5's are also closeted CJS stans and just like JYJ stans these people need to believe that Yunho and Changmin cannot succeed but they cant say it openly, so they have to come up with skewed logic to prove that SME is out to ruin HoMin-i guess thats why they gave TVXQ such a stellar comeback and an epic song like KYHD-that article from a supposed OT5 is laughable but not unexpected!

    ReplyDelete
  112. @ Hyeonmu

    Yeah, I agree that the roles assumed by CTVXQ and my blog are working great. CTVXQ is working great as a supporting fan site while I deal with the crisis & lawsuit so the fans can choose the ones to visit depending on their need. :)

    @ all

    I guess some OT5's imagination was running wild. If manufacturing fake news to satisfy themselves without facing the reality is what gets them going, oh well, let them be. It's been a while with absolutely no sign that they'll reunite, but I guess they're just incapable of leaving the dreamland they've created in their mind. Reminds me of inception. :)

    The idea SM is planning to ditch TVXQ is just not even worth talking about. Simply ridiculous.

    They're still supporting the Grace and Trax, nuff said.

    @ cat1177

    I highly doubt Shinee is in any danger. They are one of the top act in Korea and very successful, and I don't think they reached their peak yet, not even close. I don't know how the new boy group will look like, but I'm sure SM, the evil greedy money making company, will plan it well to not overlap with their existing bands to maximize the profit LOL.

    ReplyDelete
  113. @Precious

    Thank you for all your efforts of bringing more truths to this crazy world! Can't wait for your next post!

    Do you know what is going on with the lawsuit at the moment? Is the lawsuit being put on-hold? I can't find any more recent news about the lawsuit. Thanks!

    ReplyDelete
  114. i find it quite interesting how this post was about DNBN but the comments somehow digressed to shipping.

    anyways, after reading the posts and the comments, i think the jyj fans (those who bashed up homin) and jyj themselves are just too scary. i just hope that from now on, jyj and their fans will leave homin alone and stop quoting tvxq anywhere anymore to gain sympathy or more fame than they already have, at the expense of homin.

    out of curiosity, does anyone actually know how's the situation like in Korea? are most ppl still siding jyj? i really hope more ppl will find out the truth and give homin the support they truly deserve, for protecting tvxq's name and standing strong despite all that they have gone through.

    thank you precious, i'm waiting for your next post (:

    ReplyDelete
  115. @cat1177

    I was going to say the same thing that Precious did about SHINee. SHINee is super popular right now lol Their Lucifer album did so well last year, and it seems internationally they are just as well known as SNSD and Super Junior based on watching the SM Town concert lol I mean, just look at the amount of views their videos have on youtube. I doubt M1 would make a dent in SHINee's popularity - those boys can SING. And dance. When TVXQ started having this whole controversy spring up and stopped producing music for awhile, SHINee kind of became my group to fill the void since they're very talented as well (I listen to a lot of kpop groups though - although TVXQ is my number 1, I'm not one to only listen to one group and shun others lol I don't understand fanwars between groups O.o). I am very interested to see what the new group's concept will be...if they ever actually debut. Maybe SM decided to hold off until after Super Junior finishes promotions or something.

    ReplyDelete
  116. Offtopic - is it true that JYJ could have used the name TVXQ?
    Q.Were you not sad when you heard the news about the comeback [TVXQ ACT II]?
    A) Actually we considered whether we would use the name TVXQ or JYJ. We thought of using TVXQ, but we also thought that it would not be courteous to the other two members as well as our fans. We thought TVXQ would only be completed when all five members are together. Now that TVXQ is coming back as a duo, the possibility of TVXQ with all five members is gone. I feel a little bit sad about that. (Junsu)

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  117. Lol this Junsu (rolls yes) I dont know who is worse between those 3 people, their words and actions... I Just cant.

    About the DNBN I cant wait for the 2cnd part.

    ReplyDelete
  118. @Precious

    No wonder I keep seeing on certain threads to "please stop talking about this already!" -- the more truth comes out the uglier it gets. Makes you wonder how many of those people are saying "stop" out of desperation, because they know what happened at DNBN; or screaming "stop looking for conspiracies" because they're aware of the actual conspiracy lol.

    I've never frequented a fansite before cTVXQ. What happened at DNBN is completely new to me and I'm shaking my head in disbelief. That admins actually used their power to deliberately sway opinions?! How RIGHT those ringleaders thought they were at the time is not an excuse. Neither is age. Whatever power you’re given should never, ever be used to take advantage of those that trust you. (and here’s a shout out to any truly regretful former ringleader admins out there: Repent now lol! Admit what you’ve done, apologize or start a blog! /jk sorta)

    My short but intense experience with forums reminded me not to just blindly trust anybody. I mean, I love cTVXQ's site with a passion, and I'm STILL on the lookout for the elusive rogue anti comment or post or admin. How friggin' sad is that?! :-D Jeesh.

    Precious, you are clear and concise as always. Thank god you’re here.

    @Nina

    I was actually just re-reading the TVXQ name posts when I noticed your comment. Precious posted topic here: http:// truetvxq.blogspot.com/2011/02/sm-and-homins-usage-of-tvxq-name.html & here: http:// truetvxq.blogspot.com/2011/02/another-short-post-regarding-tvxq-name.html.

    ReplyDelete
  119. @Nina
    While the injunction is in place and the lawsuit is unsettled JYJ cannot use anything associated with SM ent. That includes songs and the name TVXQ. His statement was a blatant lie. Another way of manipulating there fans. Most likely it was spelled out in the injunction paperwork and and the lawsuit that SM filed against them that all things TVXQ would be off limits for them.

    ReplyDelete
  120. @shweetshar and LadyYejin - thank you. There are so many articles, posts and i just cant keep up with everything. I`m pretty new to the whole JYJ/TVXQ issue. Why is this so messed up .. i went to jyj3 blog and saw this article saying that HoMin and Sm should ask JYJ for permission to use TVXQ`s name.. the comments were so ugly and disrespectful...saying that HoMin should beg for forgiveness and that JYJ are amazing, that out of respect they didn't sue HoMin for using TVXQ`s name.
    Then i come here - a whole new world.
    As i said everything is so messed up ..

    ReplyDelete
  121. @nina
    JYJ are amazing, that out of respect they didn't sue HoMin for using TVXQ`s name

    omo let ةث laugh for a moment r they really think that their angelic oppa didnt sue homin & sm for using tvxq name out of respect yes they r so kind ppl thanx alot for jyj kind heart >>sarcast
    tell them if they can sue let them do it ..they will never do such a thing cuz they dont have the right to do so or even to ask for .. they only know how to whine to their fans on twitter with the same old broken Symphony of how they cant except to use the name of tvxq & or sing the songs of tvxq cuz it belong to the 5 members then their stans will repeat after them the same Symphony & start their brutal bash to homin as usual believe me if jyj can use the name of tvxq or sing the old songs they will do it in blink of an eye but what bother them the most that they cant so they only have the pity card game to go with it which seems their fans follow them so blindly truly they r hopeless case ..

    ReplyDelete
  122. @ talking2me
    I know they're in arbitration currently, but no details has been out. That's why there is any news about it.

    @-qm
    There are still many CJS fans in Korea, but not as many as before. General public seemed to have turned against them. TBH, most people don't even know what JYJ is or what's been going on with TVXQ fandom.

    @ Nina
    If those 3 could use the name, they would've, no doubt about it. When Shinhwa decided to not renew their contract with SM, they had to negotiate with the company to use the band's name, and that was with ALL the members of Shinhwa, so there's no way just the 3 can use the name especially when they're suing the company to VOID the contract. How can there be TVXQ without the contract? It's not like they had the band and the name before signing with SM.

    BTW, the situation is indeed messed up, but the truth is pretty clear. Just compare what JYJ side is presenting vs. this blog and see who makes more sense. If you are new to this fandom, then everything should be pretty fuzzy to you because there are so much info to digest, but once you go over the facts, you'll be able to see the clear picture.

    @ shweetshar
    Wait till you read about the details. :)

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  124. @Nina
    About TVXQ name, you can try to search at Korean Intellectual Property Rights Information System (KIPRIS) website. Here the link (remove the bracket):
    http://detseng.kipris.or(.)kr/ndetsen/loin1000a.do?method=loginTM&searchType=A

    Just type TVXQ at the free search & you'll immediately find out who own TVXQ name. That site is government website, so the information must be correct.
    Also here the link to Hyeonmu blog where you can find the list of TVXQ trademark which owned by SM Entertainment (Remove the bracket) :

    http://hyeonmu.wordpress(.)com/2011/02/16/get-your-facts-straight-sm-registered-trademarks-over-tvxq/#more-307

    You can double check Hyeonmu's list using KIPRIS (& google translate if you want to confirm the hangul written).

    To conclude:
    1. Junsu was lying in the interview. JYJ don't have any rights regarding TVXQ names including their own stage names (Xiah Junsu, Micky Yoochun, Hero Jaejoong). So, the reason JYJ don't use TVXQ name & their TVXQ stage names is simply because they don't want to be sued by SME for using them outside SME organized activities.
    2. JYJ don't have any rights regarding TVXQ songs including their own written songs for TVXQ (it's in their contract anyway). So, again, JYJ don't want to be sued by SME for singing TVXQ old songs in their concerts.

    Btw, I know the KIPRIS website from Hyeonmu, so thank you Hyeonmu ^^~

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  125. @Precious
    Thank you for answering my questions.
    I am a new fan and found out about the TVXQ saga at the beginning of this year. Look at the whole situation, I realised that TVXQ is acutally a 6 member group and SM is the 6th member. Without a backer like SM (a well-oiled machine that provides staff, song writers, songs, choreographers, stylists, etc...), I wonder what TVXQ would be like... Of course, I didn't forget that the talented & hard-working boys are also part of the equation of the success!

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  126. @ talking2me

    Oh I agree. I always considered SM to be their 6th member as well. (and SNSD's 10th member LOL). YH & CM recognized it and gave SM the credit it deserves whereas the 3 didn't. Look where they are now, nuff said. :)

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  127. @Precious, Freya87, ranon thank you for explaining the issue and sorry to Precious that i`m so offtopic.
    It is such a pity that everything gets so twisted in JYJ fandom. I was a huge fan of all 5 members, maybe Yunho biased a little because he just seems.. like what a real man should be. I tried to close my eyes and only listen to the music but then i got "twitter curious" and little by little tried to put the pieces together.
    And yes... i`m disappointed. Really disappointed. One thing that comes to my mind is .. actions are better than words. Yunho and Changmin - full respect.

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  128. Thanks Precious for unearthing further truths of this saga. And I totally agree with Winston Churchill's quote...

    “The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is.”

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  129. @freya87 and everyone else who commented.
    thank you for clearing my doubts on why wouldn't jyj sing the old songs. i read somewhere that jaejoong said the old songs are meant for all 5 members to sing tgtr (indirectly shooting Homin for singing them again, i think) and i felt like wow, that guy still has a heart. so it was all a lie? an act to gain sympathy? arghh the more i read the more upset and disappointed i get with jyj and the more admiration and respect i have for Homin.

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  130. I feel pity to those children that will be born by these women in the future; I wonder what kind of things will be taught to their children later on. I don’t understand just where this strong unreasonable hate coming from that could drive them to do this kind of things. It really didn’t help either that their oppa’s parents held that secret 6.25 meeting so they might feel it is ok and justified to hold secret meeting since their oppa’s parents did it too. Btw, is this blogger one of the ex-admin of DNBN?

    @Nina

    The first time I read that Junsu’s interview, I’ve already had this feeling of the impossibility and unreasonable of his claim on TVXQ name. TVXQ is created by SM, SM also is the one who picked the members and not the other way around. Besides, they are the one who wanted to get out from SM and filed the lawsuit. Why made such a ruckus about TVXQ name and TVXQ old songs now after TVXQ made their comeback. Really couldn’t help but questioning their motives; it seems if they can’t use TVXQ name then no one could use that name either; TVXQ name should just be buried forever or they just create drama using TVXQ fame to promote themselves.

    Wise people said that for the people who betray you, the best revenge tactic is to live a much better life than in the past in a classy and dignified manner and make the betrayers feel they are nothing to him anymore. Hmm, I get the feeling Homin is doing this tactics right now.

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  131. @ -qm
    Yup, that statement by JJ was a lie. If you think about it, even if everything he said was true, wouldn't it be a right thing to do to just keep quiet instead of whining through Twitter for all the fans to see? He knew that his tweet would cause an uproar from their fans and start another round of TVXQ bashing, but he kept saying those things via twitter to gain sympathy or maybe at this point, he just want to be relevant. If he really cared about YH & CM like many OT5 and YJ shippers claimed, he would've never tweeted something like that.

    Words are cheap, but the actions speak the truth.

    It's pretty clear who's speaking the truth.

    @ fc
    LOL, not only their children, but their boyfriends & husbands too. As a fellow man, I feel sorry for them LOLOL.

    A word of advice, when the time comes for you to marry your kids, make sure their future mother-in-law was not a JYJ stan LOL.

    No, I am not an ex-admin of DNBN. I only got involved in this fandom around October of 2010.

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  132. @Precious

    I have to agree with you. Like I said before, JYJ fandom (both idols and fans) are acting like a girl who dumped her boyfriend but refused to let them go and find their own happiness.

    Why else would they spend so much time and effort worrying about what SM, Yunho or Changmin do? Almost like they believe for JYJ to be happy and successful is when SM (or TVXQ) flopped big time.

    Erm, yeah, good luck with that. With SM's stock price surging up to 30.000krw per share and almost ALL their idols active again, it will be quite a feat to see SM suddenly crumbles from the sheer power of hate.

    @all

    About the name issue, the only people not recognizing Yunho and Changmin as TVXQ are JYJ stans (and a handful of OT5 who are CJS biased). I find that recognition from them hardly matter in the greater scheme of things.

    All in all, life's good in the TVXQ fandom, XDDD

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  133. @ Hyeonmu

    It's more like a girl who dumped her boyfriend and expected him to drink his life away, but instead, he worked hard to better himself and got another girlfriend who's much better than her, and now she's whining that she's better for him and clinging to the past memories. On top of that, her new boyfriend that she left for turned out to be a jerk. LOL

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  134. I dont know why JJ always says that he missed Homin and all. First I have nothing against JYJ as I always support TV2XQ but I dont wanna be a bitch about JYJ. It's their own desicions to leave TVXQ. Homin they rarely talk about JYJ except from press conference and some variety shows. But JJ he uses twitter "oh I miss Yunho and Changmin" and bla blablabla like 'Oh I will always be a part of TVXQ no matter what. but I left them and formed my own group.' Sorry what???? Never, Homin talk or act like that. They even hope those three to come back to them. I know because they still hurt for JYJ left them, but I found JYJ always ask for sympathy from their fans. I know its a hard time they got blocked and all but thats how life is, and thats the life they chose, of course they have to work for it. Like TVXQ got bashed as a traitor and whatever but they overcame it. TVXQ got hurt mentally, the pain and all. It's not fair for them if JYJ didnt get any problems. I know I sound bitter, shallow and all. But really, I since they formed JYJ started to dislike these three people. Why? What about TVXQ? That just selfish!
    I never talk about this because there all OT5 all over the internet. I never, NEVER even for ONCE to post anything related to JYJ on my blog, twitter or tumblr. I just dont bother myself about them. The more they tweet about Homin the more I dislike them. I feel like I wanna say "GEEZ I KNOW YOU LOVE THEM AND ALL OMFG OUR LOVE CANNOT COMPARE TO YOUR LOVE FOR THEM BUT SERIOUSLY STFU." I mean what did he want? He wanted people to sympathy for them and started to hate Homin because they never talk about how much they miss you guys after you left them and with your fans bash them all the time? They have the right to be mad at JYJ. Do JYJ ever say "stop" to their fans that bash Homin? Ever? Sorry if I missed this but I never heard any of it.
    I'm glad that I think im not alone for this matter, but I think I'm more upset than most TV2XQ fans --; sorry I'm just bitter.
    This fansite clearly, they have insider from JYJ side. Because I know SM wont bother themselves about fansites, but not JYJ's side, they more aware how important fans support are.
    Again. I'm really sorry if I offend some poeple here but that just how it is. I had enough from you guys OT5 believers but the truth is you are all JYJ fans not TV2XQ. I came to some OT5 blogs but all I saw is JYJ articles and only one or two TVXQ articles (for the sake of fakeness that they are OT5 fans). For obama sake just come out of the closet already you OT5!

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  135. @talking2me
    Absolutely!!
    I had thought the same thing. I mean, the company is relevant to the future of the band. Look at DNA. The 5 of them are cute, can sing, can dance, have charisma, a lot of talent, EVERYTHING!. But their company is just crap. They are hardly promoted in the correct way, and that's why they're a lot less great than what they deserve.

    if TVXQ was that great since their very first debut stage, that's mainly thanks to all the effort SM made in promoting them

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  136. @precious
    yea all those "i miss yunho and changmin" etc... they are SO FAKE. i agree that if they really cared, they should just leave them alone and stop bringing them up. since they have decided to leave and form a 'greater' group, they should do it using their own name and not make use of the old connections that they broke now that tvxq made an awesome comeback. it's so deja vu. jyj trying to promote themselves using tvxq yet again. it's so scary how scheming they can be, and to think that junsu was called angel xiah...

    @hyeonmu and precious
    the girl who dumped her boyfriend and now wants to cling onto past memories is SO APT! she just has nothing better to do with her own little pathetic life.

    anw, random, i just read on some chinese webby that kyhd sales currently rank 5th on hanteo ): suju's album came out 2 weeks ago and it alr topped the list. how to win GDA ))): are fans still boycotting them? roars. i just feel so frustrated...they deserve SO MUCH MORE for all the hard work that they've put in. i hope more fans can see the truth and stop blindly supporting and recognise Homin's efforts and talents, and all that they have done to protect tvxq's name.

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  137. @ -qm
    Well the boycott's still on, but you shouldn't worry since those participating weren't TVXQ fans anyways. It's really laughable that OT5 turned into JYJ fan sites are boycotting TVXQ album, but who cares? They weren't going to buy anything anyways so it really doesn't matter. TVXQ has full support of true fans, and new fans are increasing and that's what matters the most.

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  138. @momocha

    Ah, I understand where you are coming from because I initially started not mentioning JYJ and the whole issue on my Tumblr. Not that its famous or anything Lol but I just thought why talk about it you know? Then one day I was watching KYHD and Tokyo Dome performances, I saw the comments and was so frustrated? Not because I was insulted because they TVXQ was insulted just because of the whole human being aspect of it. How can one go around wishing another ill will? I have not done it to JYJ, I wish them the best on whatever it is they do. They decided to leave so be it. Just I hope they don't think it was going to be easy.

    I grew frustrated so I think I had a post where I vented.

    As to the fans I don't pile them in one category because it wouldn't be fair to pile everyone together in one mindset. Whomever supports TVXQ Yunho and Changmin, Im cool. Lol.

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  139. @precious
    yup (: i hope the new fans will continue to increase cos these are people who truly appreciate tvxq for who they are and what they represent.

    thank you for taking time out to write all these posts! hope i don't get more frustrated than i already am when i read part II.

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  140. I think most of JYJ fans forget that in entertainment world, real talent/skill is not the only factor to decide whether someone can achieve a great sucess or not. Hey, if that is the only factor, then easily The Grace would be bcm one of the most successful girls groups in Korean. There are many many ppl out there who can sing, perhaps more than some famous Korean idols out there, but ppl don't know them bcs they belong to crap agency or their agency decide to focus on other singer. JYJ and their fans should give SM some respect, even they have contract problem.

    I doubt those JYJ's crazy fangirls would like JYJ or even pay attention to them if JYJ weren't in SM back then. Seeing how they treat Homin who have amazing talents, come from a famous agency, and have great personalities like that, I can imagine what would they do to 'JYJ from an unknown agency' LOL.

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  141. @Precious
    SM is the 10th member of SNSD...LOL Imagine SM dressing up like a girl with long hair, high heel shoes and miniskirt doing a GEE number on stage...Horror!! LOL
    May be it is just like what Yunho said at Drop-knee guru this year "our big success at such a young age caused all of this" - they couldn't see anything other than themselves and their success. This is really sad.

    @enolha
    Agree! There are tones of talented people in this world. Without the right packaging, marketing and timing, talents don't shine eough to be noticed. And the right package and marketing cost money. SM got those things sorted really well. Look at their other successful artists for exsample. On the other hand, I think SM can and should do better and more in terms of looking after their artists welfare and future. May be, JYJ didn't feel being look after by SM before they decided to leave SM.

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  142. @ Precious

    I'm sorry if my previous question wasn't clear; what I mean to ask is whether this blogger who wrote about what's happened in DNBN is one of the ex-admin of DNBN?

    I agree with you that SM is the 6th member of TVXQ (It could be said Avex is the 7th member too); that's why I couldn't stand them badmouthing SM. I don't like they discredit SM roles in making TVXQ become so famous now.

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  143. @ fc

    LOL, no problem. I misunderstood you.

    I don't know who she is, but it doesn't look like she was one of ex-admin of DNBN from the way she described them, and also she stated that she didn't like the ex-admin's post initially, so most likely she was not.

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  144. I've missing a lot again due to my disappearance to China for two months. And there's so much to comment on that it got me excited!
    Well first, after reading this post, the thing that got me is how JYJ fans live with themselves after everything they have done. I know it's not my first time reading about their malicious deeds, but really this is sad.
    Second, the whole YJ thingy, never have been a fan and that's because most(not saying all) YJ fans just went overboard with this pairing. They made YJ look too realistic and it's really annoying. But I really enjoy reading comments from the POV of a YJ fan.
    Third, JJ's unbelievable 'I miss Yunho and Changmin...' tweet. My first thought was 'Seriously dude, don't make me puke with your lie. If you actually did miss them, then you probably would've never left them in the first place!' And when will he stop with these random fake sympathetic tweets that are getting on my last nerves?
    And finally, all the blame that goes to SM. It's like whenever something goes wrong with JYJ, the blame is like automatically entitled on SM. Seriously, stans, it's not like SM controls everything in the K-Pop World. They should be at least thankful to SM because without SM there would be no JYJ.

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  145. LOL glad i'm not reading this troll post before your next post was out

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  146. eh wait... what?! you had not post the rest of DNBN story *sulking*

    so i should post my comment in here then *being silly*

    I just visited DNBN site and read their announcement
    geez... they proclaimed their site as CJS fansite shamelessly
    yes agree with your translation above, their admin and member must have a bird brain, i can't even talk knowing their stupid decision when their site was taken over by a new admin without prior announcement

    waiting for your next post and thankyou for this post :3

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  147. *off topic*

    Is it true that Lee Sooman have criminal record of securities fraud of over 10 billion KRW (approximately 10 million USD) by siphoning off company funds? I'm sorry to ask here because I don't know where to ask. Thanks.

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  148. @ nini9515
    I'm guessing those JYJ fans believe they're doing the right thing for their "oppas". Blind love can sometimes make people do weird things, sad but it happens.

    @ verachan
    This just shows how easy it is to manipulate the mass during the time of crisis. It happens in real world too.

    @ Freya87
    It's a long story, and I'm going to write a post about it too. In short, yes, he was convicted of misusing public fund and received probation, but he does not have the record any more because he was pardoned by the president for his contribution to Korea and never served time in Jail. I will write a detailed post about it, and all I can tell you is that it wasn't a malicious crime for his own benefit. JYJ fans are spreading that without the actual details of what happened to cover up the criminal record of CEO of C-Jes's who actually served time in jail for blackmailing with threatening an actor. Both incidents will be covered in detail.

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  149. @Precious

    May i ask how many part of DNBN you going to write? Can't wait for the next part. Thank you for your hard work :)

    @Precious and @Freya87

    Interesting... I'm curious about that event/topic as well... since I saw it on their site. I'll wait for your though on that as well...

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  150. @ Hotaru

    I don't know. I'm not writing these posts with a "grand plan" LOL. Most likely 3-4 posts about DNBN, and few more for other sites.

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  151. I don't understand jyj's fans. They think if they prove that Lee Sooman did something bad it somehow nullify every bad thing that jyj did? I really can't understand their logic. Or are they saying that it's ok that jyj now under mafia CEO if Lee Sooman in past also was not perfect?

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  152. @ pichyasa
    They want to portrait SM as a bad company as much as they can trying to justify the 3 leaving the company. It's really a petty attempt at their part. They overblow everything SM did or even things that SM didn't do, and totally ignore any wrongdoings on jyj's part. I mean they claim that 6.25 meeting is nothing unusual, and it's a kind of meeting that happens all the tine. You can't expect any logic in their thinking.

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  153. about the DNBN thing, luckily i'm changmin biased, if not i would become one of those with the bird's brain(junsu is my second biased).. muhahaha.. but, till today, i keep praying that they could back together as 5, because it is one of my dream to be in their concert (as 5) but after seeing these evidences,i guess my dream will never come true...
    ok, changed my dream~
    haha.. waiting for changmin+yunho concert!

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  154. i just read about the fraud on a jyj fansite as well. or rather, my sis visited the site and told me about it. i think those fans are really absurd. don't know which universe they come from. how is it even possible to have such warped thinking...without LSM there wouldn't be JYJ please...biting the hand that fed you...even if LSM really did what he did, there's no need to post such news on your site since you've publicly cut ties with him. they simply love to magnify every small little thing and take things out of their original context. never ever have they provided readers/fans with the real or full story. it's funny how some people can believe some of the things they say when they obviously sound twisted and lack truth.

    @mun hesan
    same! it was my dream to watch a tvxq5 concert. but not anymore. after i read all these, i hardly think a reunion is possible cos at first i really thought it was some misunderstanding, but this is just too far. i am totally waiting for Homin concert!!! but i heard it'll be really hard for intl fans to get tix ):

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  155. @mun hesan & @-qm
    i have watched a TVXQ5 concert but i somehow wished i had not watched it...because it was quite obvious that something was already not right @ that point of time.... i could not see the interaction i had seen between the 5 of them that we always see on DVDs and even what i saw @ SMTown, which i had watched a couple of months prior to the concert...It was indeed sad...

    that being said , i am definately looking forward to a HoMin concert, whilst keeping my fingers crossed that i will be able to get the upcoming SMTown concert @ Tokyo Dome tics...

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  156. @keigo_milk
    May I ask which concert did u watch?

    I think I am lucky enough that the concerts that I've watched were all before 2009.

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  157. it was Miroticon in Bangkok in Jul 2009 ~

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  158. @keigo_milk
    are you staying in japan? i hope you get the tickets! (:

    acty i saw the mirotic tour in seoul and the tokyo dome concerts on DVD. didn't detect anything strange. but i guess in july things would have turned sour already, according to the timeline of events here ):

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  159. @-qm
    i dun stay there ... i just happened to be on holiday in japan during that period and is hoping to get my hands on a ticket ...

    Btw i guess it ain't that obvious on DVD, which i watched as well... there was just this air of "weirdness" that i felt during the concert... perhaps i was the only one who felt it, but i knew distinctly that something just wasn't right... it could also be because prior to going for the concert, i had heard some "news" abt something that was going to happen between the 5...

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  160. @Precious

    I hope you answer my question. I'm dying to know, because I believe you can tell the truth. I tried to ask this to some of my friends last year but none of them say its true. So, I think this rumor is false.

    BUT. I just want to ask again since I rather believe in your answer than crazy fangirls xD

    So my question is. "Is it true that Changmin and Jaejoong had a fight about this Lawsuit before?" I mean real fight x_x

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  161. @ momocha
    I've never even heard of that rumor before. Where did you hear that? I'd verify the source of that rumor, but as far as I know, it is not true. If that really happened, I'm sure everyone would be talking about it to no end.

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  162. I heard about this from a kCassie I met, though I didn't really understand the SamNaeBangNae part until I read it here. Anyway, I'm usually a silent reader but I'd like to say thank you :D I've heard about these issues before and It's nice to see it clearly translated.

    Also, I have a question: With JYJ's contracts, their contracts with SME is still valid is it not? But they have a contract with C-JeS? I'm sorry if I'm not making sense...D:

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  163. @ caughtmefalling
    Technically, the contract is still valid. It should be since that is what this lawsuit is about, voiding/validating the contract. According to JYJ side, C-Jes is just an agency representing the 3, but now I think everyone knows that they signed with C-Jes. I guess everything will depend on the outcome of the lawsuit.

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  164. There is question that continues to bother me,so I thought you can help..

    is void the contract mean TVXQ5 not exist???!.. Does it mean CJS has not signed any contract with sm AT ALL???

    I keep thinking about it .. i have more questions but it depends on the answer...and my ENG is limited (sorry for that).

    @Precious Thank you for your hard work.

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  165. @ Z27N

    That's how I understand it. Voiding a contract basically will nullify everything they've done with SM at least on paper, but I don't think it will change anything in real life because contract or no contract, TVXQ5 did exist, and the 3 were part of it. Now, one thing the voiding of the contract will do is that CJS will have nothing to do with TVXQ in the future. That is unless SM and the 3 can somehow cut a new deal, which I highly doubt it will ever happen, at least not in the near future.

    It's funny that some OT5 fans wish CJS to win the lawsuit because that will just guarantee that CJS won't be part of TVXQ. Well, actually even if they lose and the contract is valid, SM won't include them in TVXQ's plan so either way, they're done as TVXQ.

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  166. @Precious
    Hello again:) I`m really really curious about one thing. When Yun and Min were guests on KneeDropGuru Yun said that they didnt know that JYJ will go to such extreme measures as filing an injuction.. or something like that. After this statement i remember that he was bashed pretty bad for it and even some JYJ fans tried to prove that he was lying. So my question is what really happened there ... if you know something, of course.
    Thank you!

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  167. @Nina, From what I remember Yunho said he was unaware that JYJ were going to file an injunction-the extreme measure that Yunho and Changmin were talking about was the lawsuit that followed-as for the uproar, nothing new in the JYJ fandom, their sole goal in life is to target Yunho!!

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  168. @Nina
    I think the problem is, those basher used to believe that Homin knew that JYJ will fill an injuction and all of them supposedly did that -together-. OT5 believe that SM forced Homin so Homin didn't do it. JYJ's bias believe that Homin agreed, but then changed their mind aka 'bertrayed' JYJ. So when Yunho said they didn't know that JYJ will fill an injuction, it destroyed OT5 and JYJ's stan theory since it means JYJ did all of those things without involving Homin at all.

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  169. @Reema, Beatrixx07 .. well it really sounds pretty unbelievable that HoMin didn't know about the injuction, right? I mean.. how come JYJ didnt talk to HoMin? They obviously wanted to void their contracts, right? At least out of respect they should have told HoMin first. Crazy!
    What about the 6.25 meeting? How come HoMin changed their minds in the last hour when they didnt even know about the injuction?? Are JYJ parents that shameless?
    By the way, even i considered Yunho`s statement as something like "We knew about the injuction but didnt know that they already filed it" or something like that. I never imagined that JYJ actually didnt even mention it to HoMin...

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  170. @Nina

    I think HoMin knew that there was a disagreement between the three and the company. If you look over the 6.25 meeting, it was clear that all the parents and the members sat down in a meeting with SM's CEO, Kim Young Min. I can't say for certain, but I think even then Yunho and Changmin were still hoping that the three and SM would resolve it somehow. I mean, in a working relationship, it is not uncommon to have disagreements. I think Yunho and Changmin didn't expect the three to file an injunction that would void their contract with TVXQ, maybe they were expecting more discussions and more meetings between the three and the agency to get a solution that everyone can accept.

    And if you really look carefully in the 6.25 meeting transcript, there are several inconsistencies regarding the 'changed their minds within an hour'. Many people quickly assume that Junsu's father was talking about the filing of the injunction, but he also said about Junsu calling him about Yunho and Changmin changing their mind about the cosmetics. (Notice he shared how Junsu told him that he didn't want to talk about it with the members again and Junsu's father saying that their chance were better together as five than just three).

    He never said that Yunho and Changmin changed their minds in the last hour before they filed the injunction, but he said that the five agreed on something (still unclear if it was the cosmetic business or the injunction), but then an hour later they received a phone call saying that the two had changed their minds. "Within an hour" was not referring to one hour before the injunction was sent.

    Besides, this is a legal document we are talking about, I find it hard to believe that within an hour, the three's legal team can change the whole content of the letter they sent to SM. My own experience, any change in legal documents takes at least 1 work day because it would need to be re-reviewed and re-signed by all the related parties.

    Considering ChunJaeSu were in Japan preparing their Tokyo Dome Concert with HoMin, it would be quite a feat to change the document, send the original copy to Japan and then re-send it to Korea before finally sent to SMentertainmment.

    Also, this is just me, but if I have prepared to go into a legal battle with 5 members together, and then suddenly 2 members dropped out, I would take some time to regroup and rethink about my decision (or try to persuade the two if necessary) instead of pressing on with the lawsuit because now the playing field had changed.

    Then again, that's just me.

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  171. @Nina
    I think it's more like " Yes, we did know that they were not happy with SM, but we didn't know that they will come this far and fill injunction."
    Tell you the truth, I think HoMin didn't communicate with JSC outside work since spring 2009, maybe even earlier. If you look at staff's foto from "Secret code" tour - rift between members is seen very clear. And if we remember Yunho's father's letter, at that time(first half of 2009) JSC were constantly pressuring HoMin to take their side. It's not a surprising that HoMin didn't want to spend time and talk with JSC after that. So when JSC realized that HoMin didn't share their point of view they forgot about them and it's normal that they didn't tell them about injunction, HoMin was on the other side now, side that JSC were(is) in war with. From legal point of view JSC may be did a right thing not telling HoMin about injunction, from human point of view - I think it's shows WHAT people they are.
    But of cause it's only my imho.

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  172. @Precious or anyone that can answer this.

    Another question: Is this true that the REAL reason why Homin refused to join JYJ because SM is paying for Homin's sisters education?

    I think myself why Homin parents or Homin themselves can't pay for their sisters education? I dont think education in Korea is THAT expensive that a celebrity with good income can't afford to pay education.

    But still, if anyone knows the answer or the story behind this rumor, please share.

    I have sooo many questions about the lawsuit too....

    I remember in some interview Yunho said "Mundou Muyou" and suddenly I feel that Yunho is from the beginning never wanted to leave SM.

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  173. “Junsu's father saying that their chance were better together as five than just three” This sentence got me thinking; does he mean that the chance of them winning the lawsuit will be better when all of them file it together? It does make sense though, if they all said that SM didn’t pay or treat them well enough, (whether it’s true or not) the court, fans and public might believe them and not SM (Even with just 3, we could see that the majority of the fans believe them).

    This is just my assumption; if all of them file the lawsuit, would they also have a bigger chance to win the lawsuit for the use of TVXQ name as well (like Shinhwa case)? Then they would have the free to use TVXQ name to endorse their products. However, Yunho and Changmin didn’t agree with them, so only the 3 file the lawsuit themselves. The chance of those 3 to make the court, fans and public to believe their story become smaller. Like now, some fans would question why Yunho and Changmin didn’t leave with them if it’s that bad. I wonder if this is what drove them to hold this 625 secret meeting.

    It could also be just their parents want to protect their children from being blamed later when TVXQ break up. But then, holding secret meeting which resulted in the fans blaming SM and Homin later, isn’t something I could ever agree with.

    @ Precious

    Has SM already said that they won’t put JYJ to work as TVXQ again even if SM wins the case and the contract is deemed to be valid?

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  174. @momocha

    That's a very stupid rumor. I read in Akp before that Yunho already gave a lot of scholarships & donations so it doesn't make sense that he prioritizes other people over family by not paying his sisters educations. If I'm not wrong, Yunho bought an apartment (maybe just a room) & a house for his parents recently. With this fact he revealed at Strong Heart, do you think that he don't have money to pay for his sisters? I'm not sure who spread the rumors though, but it's sure very stupid.

    @fc
    If you try to think from SME pov, will you still accept ungrateful people who destroyed (or attempt to destroy) your name, reputation, and your products? Will you take a chance to be betrayed for the second time?

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  175. @ Freya87

    Well, yes, if it's me I might not want to work with them anymore or I might work with them again if the condition forced me to but I won't easily give them my trust anymore. They have to earn my trust from negative not zero.

    Do you not think that if putting them back together as TVXQ and Yunho & Changmin agree to it, SM will generate more profit and restore their good image and reputation in the public, SM might do it?

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  176. @Nina

    I think that's because of what yunho said on the program contradicts with their theories. JYJ stan believed in the "betrayal" theory - homin changed their mind in 1 hour; and OT5 believed in the "they are still in good term" theory - all 5 of them wanted to leave together.

    These stans even used JYJ's representing lawyer's interview done in 2009 as an evidence of "all 5 wanted to leave together initially". However, I think they actually twisted what the lawyer said in the interview.
    What those stans keep saying was the lawyer said homin decided not to file the lawsuit because the lawsuit might prevent them from being active in the industry for 2-3 years.
    But the lawyer actually said he never ever met yunho & changmin and it was JYJ only who came over for enquiry since the very begining. And he was just speculating why homin didn't take part in the lawsuit.

    I hate that JYJ's side & their stans keep twisting the fact to make themselves looks good.

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  177. @ Nina

    OT5s and JYJ fan are taking issues with what HoMin said on Knee Drop Guru because of the reasons listed by others. What HoMin said contradicts what was said in the 6.25 meeting where HoMin were supposed to leave SM with the 3, but chanced their mind within an hour. Those lies were exposed by HoMin, so that's why they're making such a big deal out of that interview. OTOH, TVXQ fans didn't even notice that statement was anything out of ordinary while watching the show until the other fans started to take issues with it.

    If you go back and read Yunho's father's statement, he also stated that they didn't know about the lawsuit. Of course everyone knew there was trouble between the company and the members, but HoMin just didn't know the 3 would go to the extreme of filing a lawsuit.

    I have a feeling that even SM didn't expect a lawsuit because SM's lawyers during the injunction trial were the lawyers for some other lawsuit they were involved with (it was music related lawsuit, I can't recall exactly what at this moment), so SM didn't even have time to assemble proper legal team to represent them. That's one of the reason some TVXQ fans believe that the 3 got a favorable injunction judgment. SM got a new team for subsequent trial sessions.

    @ fc
    SM always maintained that they'd accept the 3 back if they came back and nothing else. At this point, I think it's just a mere gesture because except for OT5 fans and few clueless non-fans, nobody believes that they can work together as 5. At least in Korea and Japan, majority of TVXQ fans do not want the 3 back.

    As you said, SM may do it if getting the 5 back makes sense business wise (SM is a company after all), but TV2XQ has proven they could be as popular as TVXQ5 so I am not sure SM would want to take a risk of taking the 3 back. SM has already invested so much on the 2, and bringing back the 3 is a huge gamble at this point especially when the truth is well known to Korean and Japanese fans. There's also the trust and chemistry issues as well.

    IMO, this TV2XQ comeback sort of worked out for TVXQ because they were able to create a new image for the band. TVXQ5 still had that cute boy band image which could feel stale after a while, but the new TVXQ2 were able to reinvent themselves as grown adult men. They look polished and more high class than before, and that image influences the type of ad/commercial deals they get as well. SM always pushed TVXQ as higher class band, and this new image has raised the bar once again, so it kind of worked out.

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  178. @Hyeonmu well this is the first time that i`m hearing such a theory :) But if it was like that (HoMin changing their mind about the cosmetic business, not about the injuction) JYJ fans wouldnt have spread such a rumour about HoMin betraying JYJ.. after all not wanting to deal with the cosmetic business is hardly any sort of a betrayal.

    @Precious i get it now. I still remember the allkpop article .. it was filled with so much hate. JYJ fans were absolutely sure that Yunho was lying. I guess JYJ fans forget pretty easily that their oppas have twitter and Junsu could have immediately tweeted something like :'Hyung!! How could you lie like that!!!'

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  179. @ momocha

    LOL, now they're saying HoMin stayed in SM because of WHAT??? That's so ridiculous, it's almost comical.

    Those people must think that HoMin do not have any money. Oh wait, that's right!!! SM didn't pay TVXQ anything so HoMin must be poor, not even have any money to pay for their sisters' tuition. Now it makes perfect sense!!! (sarcasm)

    Well, HoMin are probably richer than most of the fans posting here. I know they got more money than I do. :) So to suggest that they made a decision of a lifetime based on such trivial matter as college tuition is simply laughable. Those antis should come up with more convincing lies than that.

    As Freya87 said above, they've been providing scholarships and making donations to orphanages for a while so that rumor's not true.

    Notice that with same amount of pay, some members made donations to the society while others took advances from SM. That certainly makes you wonder, doesn't it? :)

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  180. @fc

    That is my theory as well. If all five had filed the lawsuit together, this matter would have been finished a long time ago. Together, they could not only get out from SM, they could also challenge SM for the possession of the name, just like Shinwa.

    In an article written after the injunction, JYJ's lawyer once said that they will proceed with the lawsuit as soon as possible, as well as getting HoMin to come aboard with the lawsuit. I think the fact that HoMin is still here shows they didn't agree to it, even after the injunction was granted (showing that the court was quite favorable toward JYJ).

    I personally think that the intention of 6.25 wasn't purely to bash HoMin, the parents said several times on how fans should ask why the two don't stick with the three or to leave as five. I personally see it as an attempt to use the fans to socially persuade HoMin to join JYJ in the injunction and the lawsuit. But things don't always go as planned, and I think some personal fans kinda blow things out of control.

    @Nina

    I won't say I know what JYJ stans are thinking, because I'm not them and honestly seeing their arguments makes me want to headdesk most of the time, but I can tell you what I have seen myself.

    I am active on twitter, and I was exposed to some of the quite extreme JYJ stans, and a few Chunsas. They seem like they really enjoy putting down others, especially when comparing them with their own bias. It's not "I like Yoochun because bla bla bla", its "did you see XXX kissing scene? it's so unnatural compared to Yoochun, I don't get why they call him a better actor when it's obvious Yoochun's better."

    Seeing those comments, for me, it seemed like for some JYJ stans, HoMin needs to be wrong, in order for JYJ to be right. HoMin and SM needs to fail and crumble, for JYJ to be successful (this is why JYJ3 loves posting bad news about SM, but never the good ones).

    This is why they bash HoMin or spread the 'betrayal' theory, because otherwise they can't explain why the two members known to be mature, responsible and smart didn't join in on the lawsuit.

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  181. @ Precious

    Ah, yes, I do think SM pushed TVXQ as a high class image. I think it might be because at that time, SM wants TVXQ to have high class image so SM didn’t want the 3 to have anything to do with Crebeau. SM wanted TVXQ to do the ad for Missha at that time but it’s impossible for those 3 to do the ad for Missha while they invest in another cosmetic brand.

    Well, business wise, why should the 3 have to ad for another rival business? I think this might be also where the conflict of interest between SM and those 3 started. Those 3 might want TVXQ to endorse Crebeau but SM disagrees since Crebeau hasn’t had that high class image and reputation like Missha. Maybe that’s also why SM said dealing with Crebeau will damage the image that TVXQ have.

    I know that the majority of Korea and I-fans don’t want the 3 back but are Japanese fans also like that? I get the feeling that the majority of them seems like OT5 who still support 5 of them separately as TVXQ and JYJ; they might gladly accept 5 of them working together again.

    @ Hyeonmu

    I also personally think that 6.25 meeting might be an effort to put more pressure to Homin so that they might relent and join JYJ in lawsuit in the end since 5 is better than 3 after all. It also could be because they knew that Homin don’t want to join them at all so they did 6.25 meeting to create a favorable situation for them before the lawsuit, the chaos and the break up began. Quite a well planned strategy if this is such a case.

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  182. @Hyeonmu i still think this meeting is held just to "create a favorable situation" as FC said. And even apart from the statement that HoMin changed their minds in one hour, JYJ`s parents made several obviously untrue statements about SM.
    I cant understand Korean so i`m not quite sure what rumours were spreading back then. But dont you think that if the parents were talking about the cosmetics, there would be some fans discussing this topic? Some JYJ fans can be pretty immature and ridiculous but.. come on.. all of them?
    "It was agreed that if they leave, they’d leave together, or if they stay, they’d stay together, but right now the two are split." - this sentence pretty much says it all.

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  183. @fc

    Agreed, if you consider it very carefully it was a very well thought of strategy. A malicious, underhanded strategy in my own opinion, but quite impressive. The leaked audio recording really screwed up the whole plan though, because not only people can hear and judge for themselves, it is actually a solid evidence if SM/TVXQ/HoMin parents decide to pursue a legal action... I just hope it won't get there... I am tired of legal battles, LOL, just want HoMin to continue on as TVXQ.

    @Nina

    Won't disagree with you. I certainly get the feeling that the meeting did put SM, HoMin and their parents on the spot, I just don't want to judge people too harshly (yes, people has been saying I'm too nice).

    My greatest problem isn't who attended it or the matter discussed, it's the fact it was held without any member of TVXQ, any representative of SM, or HoMin parents. I just think it's totally impolite to talk about someone like that behind their back, even if it's done in defense of their children.

    TOTALLY OFF TOPIC:

    TVXQ performed last at A-Nation today. Yes, LAST, even after Ayumi and the special guest X-Japan... A lot of BE's on my timeline were surprised and said they tear up because they're just so proud...

    Ah, what a good day!!!

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  184. @Hyeonmu LOL.. you know what? I`d be more than happy if your theory is right... for the sake of .. the world being a better place :D I know they were trying to protect their children, but there is really no excuse for such a protection. It`s just sad and... somehow infuriating.

    LAST?? :)))) *happy dance*
    What a god day indeed !!:D

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  185. @ Hyeonmu

    Yes, even if the recording could be the solid evidence but I hope that Yunho and Changmin won’t follow JYJ step by suing them; just leave the suing part to JYJ and C-Jes since they like doing it or at least threaten to do it now and then. Yunho and Changmin just need to cherish their past and focus on present and future as TVXQ; let the bygone, bygone.

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  186. @ fc
    Many Japanese fans are aware of what happened. J-fans never had JYJ fans spreading malicious rumors like in Korea, so they were pretty quick on finding out the truth. There are still OT5 fans, but the current TVXQ fans do not want the 3 to come back.

    The proof? Osaka A-Nation.

    At the first day of Osaka A-Nation, Ayumi had a collaboration stage with Junsu's brother Junho, who had a stage name "Juno-Junho" and performed a songs called "Why". He was also wore attire very similar to what Yunho was wearing during TVXQ's Superstar performance. Ayumi also spoke on stage about TVXQ5, wishing to see the 5 to come back. Well, TVXQ fans took offense to that and walked out on Ayumi the next day. Majority of A-Nation attendees were TVXQ fans, and what Ayumi and Avex did was directly insulting the fans who came to support TV2XQ. I mean pleeeease... Juno-Junho? A song titled "Why" and wearing similar attire to Yunho? On top of that, wishing the 5 to come back? It was all said and done right after the TVXQ's stage, so of course TVXQ fans would get upset.

    From what I've heard, that's why TVXQ performed at the end in Tokyo A-Nation after X-Japan and Ayumi, to prevent the empty seats left by TVXQ fans.

    This episode shows that the support for TV2XQ is strong as ever (A-Nation was full of red lights), and it appears that there are a lot more new fans than we initially thought, and those new fans certainly don't want the 3 to come back.

    BTW, this was the first time in 10 years of A-Nation that Ayumi was not the last artist to perform. It's pretty amazing that even last year, Yunho and Changmin's career seemed to be over, but in such a short time, they've achieved so much and re-established their status as TVXQ with sheer determination and effort. I'm very curious to see how their new Japanese album will do. It's an exciting time to be a TVXQ fan. :)

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  187. @Precious

    Can you link the article or comments where you read about that incident? I'm a bit surprised that Ayumi would say something like that honestly. I know she was a TVXQ fan back when they were five. But to say something like that during A-Nation, when TVXQ is just Changmin and Yunho, right after they had performed, and when it's obvious that a lot of the crowd are members of BigEast? I'm very shocked...and disappointed.

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  188. @ treya_barton
    I read about it in Korean sites. There wasn't an official news article about it. I'm sure if you search Japanese fan sites, you can find more info about it from BigEasts who attended the concert. I believe Korean fans read tweets from Japanese fans from the concert to find out about the incident.

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  189. @Precious

    *raises hand* am one of those new fans not wanting the 3 anywhere near Yunho and Changmin. I won't be delusional and say their popularity before has nothing to do with what they have achieved now. It's a factor but a more significant factor to it is solely theirs: hardwork, determination, professionalism and I will even add their chic and elegant image and looks. Their CFs - the brands: Shilla, Missha, 7/11, Pepsi - are proofs of that. Their album are 100% theirs therefore the success is theirs alone - ofcourse SME gave them support =D

    I'm so excited with the album as well. Like you, it's more on curiousity..what will it achieve, what's in it, what kind of evolution will they show us again, how much praise will they get for this again, etc. etc. etc.

    It's amazing how fast time flies. How much change (for the better) these two have achieved since January. In that ViVi interview, Changmin mentioned their "promotion" as night-time performers in A-Nation. And just yesterday, on that very same A-Nation, they were promoted once again as "the" final performers. WoW. just WoW. They are closing shows not just in Korea but in Japan as well. WoW. I bet it was a very pleasant surprise for the boys ^^ I can't wait to hear what they think about it ^^

    on another note: WTF was that? Juno Junho? Why? Similar attire? Talk about riding someone else's popularity. I thought the 3 were the only ones who likes to do this through their tweets and interviews and want/need to use TVXQ name to advertise their pyramid-business...it looks like I was wrong. even Ayumi was talking about AKTF iLOL

    I was right about the empty seats cos it happened in Ehime? or somewhere else where fans left after TVXQ performance. and I was speculating about fan reaction to Juno, hence his absence in Tokyo show.. looks like I was 'almost' right. orz why the hell did Avex pull that stunt?!?!

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  190. @ girlpower
    Yeah, no one denies the work the 3 did when they were TVXQ, and TVXQ5 was great. However, the 3 almost destroyed TVXQ, and they walked out on the group on their own, so that's that.

    It's funny that JYJ was suspended by Avex, but Junsu's brother Junho signs with Avex, then try to ride TVXQ's fame. Some JYJ fans also criticize Junsu's family for dealing with the "evil" Avex. This whole thing is so funny, and unreal at the same time. Of course, you can probably guess what the TVXQ fans think about this whole mess. :)


    TVXQ fans don't really trust Avex 100%, and believe that Avex is not fully supporting TVXQ considering the lack of promotion for the "Superstar" single. Avex already betrayed Yunho and Changmin once, so the fans are nervous that they could do it again. I don't know exactly what's going on between SM and Avex, but it's not all flowers and sunshine for sure.

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  191. @Precious:
    From what I know Ayumi did not say it at the venue, but tweeted that she would want to see the 5 together, and also said something regarding the redundant AKTF slogan-I might be wrong but everyone was talking about her responding to a fan's comment with the comment that she was also waiting for the five!

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  192. @ Reema
    Oh really? I've read that she mentioned about the 5 at the venue. It would be nice if anyone who knows Japanese can verify it.

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  193. @Reema
    If she talked about it in twitter as reply for fan's comment, I think she said that more bcs she want to say good things to her fan. Many artist did that. She may or may not really wish for all 5, but if a fan told her how she/he wish to see TVXQ5 again, as an idol, she answered that to maker her fans happy. If she did that in venue too, it's possible that she did that for same reason. Perhaps she thought the fans still waiting for TVXQ5, especially since Junsu's bro also there. She also JJ's friend too, if I'm not wrong. Well..it's possibly that she is TVXQ5's fan too LOL

    I think Avex try to make Junsu's bro more popular by using TVXQ's fame. Though I wonder if they realise it's make TVXQ's fans don't like it. It's all about business and myb they want to attract Junsu fans by using his bro. If they can't use Junsu, at least they can use his bro. I bet Junsu's bro is so happy about that (including Junsu). He'd prefer to join Avex than his's bro agency LOL.

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  194. It's sad about the Junho/Zuno thing because I actually liked his songs when they were released in Chinese awhile ago. I thought it was weird he signed with Avex though considering everything that's going on. And now the Yunho thing. I wonder how much of it is his choice though. I dunno.

    Anyway, I was super disappointed about the Superstar promotions. Avex never uploaded a full pv for Superstar >.> And I haven't been able to find really nice quality versions of Superstar or I Don't Know. Even the HD I Don't Know pv is kind of blurry. I wish Korean companies would upload their Japanese stuff on their Korean youtube pages so we could watch better quality honestly. I know the music is usually distributed separately and stuff...but they should find a way to work it into the contract.

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  195. @all
    I'm Akicha from continueTVXQ forum.
    I want to clarify that it's not true Ayu mentioned on stage that she wishes to see the 5 to come back. She mentioned that in her twitter far before, in Matsuura's twitter incident regarding "Wasurenaide", as a response to a fan's tweet.
    Here's what she said:
    MOCHUN64: ayu-chan, do you like the 5 Tohoshinki members? Will you wait for the 5 of them to reunite with all of us? The CEO too… I hope…
    ayu_19980408: Yes, I like them. I know of nobody who is not waiting for the 5 of them.
    Source:http://misachanjpop.wordpress.com/2011/07/18/ayu-tweets-1872011-twitter-war/
    I think everyone can see that she didn't mean any harm, only that she's pretty much still an OT5 fan and IMO there's nothing wrong about it.
    I've been reading various Japanese blogs about A Nation concert fanaccounts, and there's not one that mentioned Ayu's being disrespectful toward TV2XQ. Not even in the most TV2XQ fanatic blog, like u-kyou san's blog (probably some of you are familiar with her blog and knows her zeal in defending and supporting TV2XQ), as well as in other prominent blogs like Watanabe san's (Bigea730) or Sora san's (soratomax), and they attended both Osaka and Tokyo concerts.
    Instead, they mentioned briefly that Ayu was 'cute' and she did well in firing up the audience.
    It's true that many fans left the concert after Tohoshinki's performance,but not because any of Ayu's saying, but simply because they came solely to watch TVXQ and didn't wish to stay longer. Bigeast are asking fellow fans to put Tohoshinki's goods inside their bags if they do this, so it won't reflect negatively to Tohoshinki's name.
    The fans that talk bad about Ayu are probably misinformed, she has done nothing but being very supportive. She even waved Tohoshinki's red towel instead of her own towel during A Nation concerts. I really cannot find any fault in Ayu, except that she has been friends with five of them, probably one is closer than others, and she still maintains that friendship tie now. She's never spiteful or said any unwise comment especially in stage.

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  196. @Precious
    I understand the sentiments of TVXQ fans not trusting avex 100% considering what happened. Personally, betrayal is something that doesn't deserve second chances. ^^ Despite everything that happened between avex and SME, it seems like it isn't very easy for them to pull-out of avex. I just hope that there isn't anything like an air of animosity towards Yunho and Changmin backstage or when they are at avex (if they ever go to avex bldg or sth). >.>

    @treya_barton
    I dunno... the MVs might not have been uploaded in YT because it was included in the CD/DVD version of the Single (I Don't Know) and MV of Superstar will be included in CD/DVD version of the album along with a new vid for the song and KYHD (Japanese version). So it's a little bit reasonable.....But then again, KYHD MV was included in the Japanese version album but was uploaded in their channel on Jan 18 when the Japanese single was released jan 26. (o.o) *sigh*

    As a new fan, I am not aware as to how they promoted their single/albums before. And at first I thought their month-long promotions and features in so many magazines a month before and during the release were considered more than enough promotions. But then again, most of the promotions were made cos of Tohoshinki's collaboration with Seven & i. Dx *le sigh*

    I'm also disappointed cos SME did/is not uploading alot of TVXQ news nor Superstar/IDK MVs in their Facebook page. That's why I am so thankful for CTVXQ.com.

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  197. And Junho didn't wear attire similar to Yunho, he wore one similar to CHANGMIN's.
    Some tweets mentioned during Osaka's A Nation after Tohoshinki's performance:
    "Tohoshinki's fans please come back! Changmin is singing together with Ayu!"
    The twitter went busy for awhile, but then there's a clarification,
    "Stop spreading rumor! It's not Changmin but Junho, who wear similar clothes!"
    It was even more confusing because of the song's title, "Why", even after people found out that it was Junho and not Changmin who collaborate with Ayu, questions such as " 'WHY'? It isn't that 'WHY', right?" kept popping out. And then there was another clarification, "No, it's another 'WHY'

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  198. oh didn't know this thread was still moving!

    @Precious

    interesting! (about Ayu.) i read something about her twitter too, about keeping faith for whatever (don't know if she was directly alluding to AKTF though, i forgot the details of that tweet). someone told me that THSK were put last to prevent their fans from leaving but i didn't know about the Juno thing and that BE were offended in Osaka. whatever the case it's still a huge thing to break a 10 yr tradition by not making Ayu close the concert, and in their last A-Nation stop no less. this will also be the show that will be aired next month and recorded on DVD right? BE are a peaceful and very mature group of fans but don't piss them off.

    p.s. Juno Junho? for real?? --_--
    just googled him and his stage costume is.... --_-- maybe his stylist is a Toho fan.

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